From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Tue May  5 14:06:04 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 14:06:04 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] [Fwd: Re:  windows linux network and printer]
Message-ID: <4A00800C.2020706@gmail.com>

This bounced the first time

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [mdlug] windows linux network and printer
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2009 11:27:46 -0400
From: Aaron Kulkis <akulkis00 at gmail.com>
To: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
References: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0904300923500.13086-100000 at home.nuge.com>

Jay Nugent wrote:
> Greetings,
> 
> On Thu, 30 Apr 2009, Aaron Kulkis wrote:
> 
>> Ken Spress wrote:
>>
>>> CUPS printer configuration and management is handled by the Printer Admin
>>> utility launched from the Gnome menu - System -> Administration -> Printing.
>> Or, more generally from a web browser with:
>> http://localhost:631/
>>
>> or from another machine:
>> http://host.name.here:631/
> 
>    So what do you do to configure CUPS via a browser from workstation on 
> the same LAN when the server you point the browser to only returns a 
> "403 Forbidden" message?  :(
> 
>    I have cups on a headless server (CentOS) that has NO GUI.  It's a
> "server" afterall...  So from my workstation, when pointing my browser to
> http://server1.nuge.com:631 all I ever get is a 403 Forbidden.

Strange.

1.
workstation:> ssh server1.nuge.com
Password:
nuge:> lynx localhost:631



2. It might be here in this section of  /etc/cups/cupsd.conf:


########
######## Browsing Options
########

#
# Browsing: whether or not to broadcast and/or listen for CUPS printer
# information on the network.  Enabled by default.
#

#Browsing On

#
# BrowseProtocols: which protocols to use for browsing.  Can be
# any of the following separated by whitespace and/or commas:
#
#     all  - Use all supported protocols.
#     cups - Use the CUPS browse protocol.
#     slp  - Use the SLPv2 protocol.
#
# The default is "cups".
#
# NOTE: If you choose to use SLPv2, it is *strongly* recommended that
#       you have at least one SLP Directory Agent (DA) on your
#       network.  Otherwise, browse updates can take several seconds,
#       during which the scheduler will not respond to client
#       requests.
#

#BrowseProtocols cups

#
# BrowseAddress: specifies a broadcast address to be used.  By
# default browsing information is not sent!
#
# Note: HP-UX does not properly handle broadcast unless you have a
# Class A, B, C, or D netmask (i.e. no CIDR support).
#
# Note: Using the "global" broadcast address (255.255.255.255) will
# activate a Linux demand-dial link with the default configuration.
# If you have a LAN as well as the dial-up link, use the LAN's
# broadcast address.
#
# The @LOCAL address broadcasts to all non point-to-point interfaces.
# For example, if you have a LAN and a dial-up link, @LOCAL would
# send printer updates to the LAN but not to the dial-up link.
# Similarly, the @IF(name) address sends to the named network
# interface, e.g. @IF(eth0) under Linux.  Interfaces are refreshed
# automatically (no more than once every 60 seconds), so they can
# be used on dynamically-configured interfaces, e.g. PPP, 802.11, etc.
#

#BrowseAddress x.y.z.255
#BrowseAddress x.y.255.255
#BrowseAddress x.255.255.255
#BrowseAddress 255.255.255.255
#BrowseAddress @LOCAL
#BrowseAddress @IF(name)

#
# BrowseShortNames: whether or not to use "short" names for remote printers
# when possible (e.g. "printer" instead of "printer at host".)  Enabled by
# default.
#

#BrowseShortNames Yes

#
# BrowseAllow: specifies an address mask to allow for incoming browser
# packets. The default is to allow packets from all addresses.
#
# BrowseDeny: specifies an address mask to deny for incoming browser
# packets. The default is to deny packets from no addresses.
#
# Both "BrowseAllow" and "BrowseDeny" accept the following notations for
# addresses:
#
#     All
#     None
#     *.domain.com
#     .domain.com
#     host.domain.com
#     nnn.*
#     nnn.nnn.*
#     nnn.nnn.nnn.*
#     nnn.nnn.nnn.nnn
#     nnn.nnn.nnn.nnn/mm
#     nnn.nnn.nnn.nnn/mmm.mmm.mmm.mmm
#     @LOCAL
#     @IF(name)
#
# The hostname/domainname restrictions only work if you have turned hostname
# lookups on!
#

#BrowseAllow address
#BrowseDeny address

BrowseAllow @LOCAL
BrowseDeny All

#
# BrowseInterval: the time between browsing updates in seconds.  Default
# is 30 seconds.
#
# Note that browsing information is sent whenever a printer's state changes
# as well, so this represents the maximum time between updates.
#
# Set this to 0 to disable outgoing broadcasts so your local printers are
# not advertised but you can still see printers on other hosts.
#

#BrowseInterval 30

#
# BrowseOrder: specifies the order of BrowseAllow/BrowseDeny comparisons.
#

#BrowseOrder allow,deny
#BrowseOrder deny,allow

#
# BrowsePoll: poll the named server(s) for printers
#

#BrowsePoll address:port

#
# BrowsePort: the port used for UDP broadcasts.  By default this is
# the IPP port; if you change this you need to do it on all servers.
# Only one BrowsePort is recognized.
#

#BrowsePort 631

#
# BrowseRelay: relay browser packets from one address/network to another.
#

#BrowseRelay source-address destination-address
#BrowseRelay @IF(src) @IF(dst)

#
# BrowseTimeout: the timeout for network printers - if we don't
# get an update within this time the printer will be removed
# from the printer list.  This number definitely should not be
# less the BrowseInterval value for obvious reasons.  Defaults
# to 300 seconds.
#

#BrowseTimeout 300




> 
>    What needs to be added or edited in /etc/cups/cupsd.conf to get this
> beast to at least let me *begin* to start configuring it????
> 

did you try using  using lynx?

> 
>    The only lines I have edited in cupsd.conf so far are:
> 
>       ####LogLevel info
>       LogLevel debug2        <------- more verbose error logs
>  
> 
>       Listen localhost:631
>       ## jjn 090429 -- Added following line
>       Listen 216.144.208.28:631  <-- web access went from not responding 
>                                      at all to now giving a 403 Forbidden 
>                                      message
> 
> 
>    Thanks!
>       --- Jay
>              
> Train how you will Operate, and you will Operate how you were Trained.
> +------------------------------------------------------------------------+
> | Jay Nugent   jjn at nuge.com    (734)484-5105    (734)649-0850/Cell       |
> |   Nugent Telecommunications  [www.nuge.com]                            |
> |   Internet Consulting/Linux SysAdmin/Engineering & Design/ISP Reseller |
> | ISP Monitoring [www.ispmonitor.org] ISP & Modem Performance Monitoring |
> | Web-Pegasus    [www.webpegasus.com] Web Hosting/DNS Hosting/Shell Accts|
> +------------------------------------------------------------------------+
>   9:01am  up 22 days,  8:14,  4 users,  load average: 0.12, 0.06, 0.01
> 
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug



From fulner at gmail.com  Tue May  5 17:49:49 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Tue, 5 May 2009 17:49:49 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
Message-ID: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>

OK,

So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.

At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should? Obviously
I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.

Yours in Liberty,
Jim


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Wed May  6 10:58:04 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 10:58:04 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Digital camcorders & Linux
Message-ID: <32976490.1241621885204.JavaMail.root@elwamui-muscovy.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Hello,

I am looking for a digital camcorder and I was wondering if anyone had any experience (good or bad) while using a camcorder with a linux box. Basically, I may want to download from the camcorder to the Linux box an burning the video to a DVD (using Myth?) etc. I am not planning to do any fancy video editing. Any issues with proprietary format etc that I should be aware of?

Thanks for any help


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Wed May  6 10:24:36 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 10:24:36 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with this?
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

It looks like the latest Ubuntu has built-in support for the key PS3
updates I want. (WPA support over wifi, and ps3-vram swap support.) So,
I figure I'll be pulling the trigger soon and stick Linux on my PS3.

 The only thing holding me back for now is the availability of a
big-enough backup drive, but it looks like I can borrow one for long
enough. I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
project - a Forth interpreter
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) ) running on
the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).

 Does anyone have any experience with this? Any gotchas I should look
out for?

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                              (313) 227-2317

 "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers.
  You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions." 
               -  Naguib Mahfouz
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From driveray at ameritech.net  Thu May  7 02:20:23 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 02:20:23 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A027DA7.5070808@ameritech.net>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> OK,
> 
> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
> 
> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should? Obviously
> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.
> 
> Yours in Liberty,
> Jim


I seriously doubt it make any difference. But that's just me.



From ldaphelp at thuemmel.com  Thu May  7 06:16:34 2009
From: ldaphelp at thuemmel.com (Mark Thuemmel)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 06:16:34 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Digital camcorders & Linux
In-Reply-To: <32976490.1241621885204.JavaMail.root@elwamui-muscovy.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <32976490.1241621885204.JavaMail.root@elwamui-muscovy.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4A02B502.9080904@thuemmel.com>

R. Kannan wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I am looking for a digital camcorder and I was wondering if anyone had any experience (good or bad) while using a camcorder with a linux box. Basically, I may want to download from the camcorder to the Linux box an burning the video to a DVD (using Myth?) etc. I am not planning to do any fancy video editing. Any issues with proprietary format etc that I should be aware of?
> 
> Thanks for any help

I bought a used Sony Camcorder with an i.LINK port for $100 on
Craigslist.  Added a $15 firewire card to my pc and cable.

This IEEE 1394 interface is also known by the brand names of FireWire
(Apple Inc.), i.LINK (Sony), and Lynx (Texas Instruments)

I do a "sudo chmod 777 /dev/raw1394" after plugging it in to talk to it
on my Ubuntu box, but after that Kino works well for capturing the video
off the camera and basic editing and then saving to mpeg.

Takes a lot of disk space.  Transcoding isn't too bad on my dual core cpu.

My kids make homemade videos and post them up to YouTube with it.


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Thu May  7 09:19:04 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 09:19:04 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [mdlug] Digital camcorders & Linux
Message-ID: <24535178.1241702344869.JavaMail.root@mswamui-valley.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Can any of the open source application read/transcode AVCHD format?

Thanks

-----Original Message-----
>From: Mark Thuemmel <ldaphelp at thuemmel.com>
>Sent: May 7, 2009 6:16 AM
>To: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
>Subject: Re: [mdlug] Digital camcorders & Linux
>
>R. Kannan wrote:
>> Hello,
>> 
>> I am looking for a digital camcorder and I was wondering if anyone had any experience (good or bad) while using a camcorder with a linux box. Basically, I may want to download from the camcorder to the Linux box an burning the video to a DVD (using Myth?) etc. I am not planning to do any fancy video editing. Any issues with proprietary format etc that I should be aware of?
>> 
>> Thanks for any help
>
>I bought a used Sony Camcorder with an i.LINK port for $100 on
>Craigslist.  Added a $15 firewire card to my pc and cable.
>
>This IEEE 1394 interface is also known by the brand names of FireWire
>(Apple Inc.), i.LINK (Sony), and Lynx (Texas Instruments)
>
>I do a "sudo chmod 777 /dev/raw1394" after plugging it in to talk to it
>on my Ubuntu box, but after that Kino works well for capturing the video
>off the camera and basic editing and then saving to mpeg.
>
>Takes a lot of disk space.  Transcoding isn't too bad on my dual core cpu.
>
>My kids make homemade videos and post them up to YouTube with it.


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From dcweyh at gmail.com  Thu May  7 09:40:59 2009
From: dcweyh at gmail.com (Darwin Weyh)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 09:40:59 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <cdb5824d0905070640o6bffec7ama39e675ba53abbed@mail.gmail.com>

I send them off but I doubt they will do anything but it will help to fill
the database with Open Source Programs so maybe some Data Analysist will put
it in a report someday.

Darwin Weyh
Underemployed Computer Consultant
Email: dcweyh at gmail.com
Site: www.weyh.net
Current Project: www.skillzdesk.com


On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Robert Jim Fulner <fulner at gmail.com> wrote:

> OK,
>
> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
>
> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should?
> Obviously
> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.
>
> Yours in Liberty,
> Jim
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>


From dcweyh at gmail.com  Thu May  7 09:36:55 2009
From: dcweyh at gmail.com (Darwin Weyh)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 09:36:55 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with this?
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <cdb5824d0905070636p5ff28db5l926b4a6af285dd06@mail.gmail.com>

Ahh FORTH.  I havn't heard much about that for 25 years.  I was once told
it's a programming language that used the programmer as the compiler.

Have fun with that.

Underemployed Computer Consultant
Email: dcweyh at gmail.com
Site: www.weyh.net
Current Project: www.skillzdesk.com


On Wed, May 6, 2009 at 10:24 AM, Ingles, Raymond <
Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com> wrote:

> It looks like the latest Ubuntu has built-in support for the key PS3
> updates I want. (WPA support over wifi, and ps3-vram swap support.) So,
> I figure I'll be pulling the trigger soon and stick Linux on my PS3.
>
>  The only thing holding me back for now is the availability of a
> big-enough backup drive, but it looks like I can borrow one for long
> enough. I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
> project - a Forth interpreter
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language)<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_%28programming_language%29>) running on
> the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).
>
>  Does anyone have any experience with this? Any gotchas I should look
> out for?
>
>  Sincerely,
>
>  Ray Ingles                              (313) 227-2317
>
>  "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers.
>  You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions."
>               -  Naguib Mahfouz
> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It
> contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named
> addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose
> it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately
> and then destroy it.
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>


From lugnuts at doehler.us  Thu May  7 09:58:02 2009
From: lugnuts at doehler.us (Joe Doehler)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 09:58:02 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with  this?
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.na
	sa.cpwr.corp>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <E1M246I-0003qQ-00@doehler.us>

At 10:24 AM 5/6/2009, Ray wrote:
 >I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
>project - a Forth interpreter
>(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) ) running on
>the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).

Thanks for the tip. I am downloading Yellowdog for PS3 as I write this.

The PS3 has some formidable performance potential:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cell_(microprocessor)

I doubt that all that potential can be used with Yellowdog. Some web 
sites state that Sony locks out access to the SPU's when alternate 
OS's are installed, in fear that they could be used for cracking 
their games, but some people appear to have broken that barrier:
http://www.physorg.com/news92674403.html

Joe.




From starline at wideopenwest.com  Thu May  7 10:09:20 2009
From: starline at wideopenwest.com (bob dion)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 10:09:20 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <cdb5824d0905070640o6bffec7ama39e675ba53abbed@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<cdb5824d0905070640o6bffec7ama39e675ba53abbed@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A02EB90.3020604@wideopenwest.com>

Why give MS anymore ammo, than it already has, to screw with competitive 
products.

BD

Darwin Weyh wrote:
> I send them off but I doubt they will do anything but it will help to fill
> the database with Open Source Programs so maybe some Data Analysist will put
> it in a report someday.
> 
> Darwin Weyh
> Underemployed Computer Consultant
> Email: dcweyh at gmail.com
> Site: www.weyh.net
> Current Project: www.skillzdesk.com
> 
> 
> On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Robert Jim Fulner <fulner at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> OK,
>>
>> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
>>
>> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
>> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
>> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should?
>> Obviously
>> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
>> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
>> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
>> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
>> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.
>>
>> Yours in Liberty,
>> Jim
>> _______________________________________________
>> mdlug mailing list
>> mdlug at mdlug.org
>> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
> 


From lugnuts at doehler.us  Thu May  7 10:13:50 2009
From: lugnuts at doehler.us (Joe Doehler)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 10:13:50 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with  this?
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.na
	sa.cpwr.corp>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <E1M24Kr-0003qb-00@doehler.us>

Here's more info on installing Linux on a PS3:

First, a dual-boot configuration must be created:
http://tinyurl.com/dxg56d

Likely, all the stuff you have stored on the PS3 will be gone.

Second, install a Linux distribution that uses all the SPU's:
http://www.ps3cluster.umassd.edu/step1setup.html

This installation also enables the optional creation of PS3 clusters 
- just in case you want your own supercomputer...

Joe.



From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Thu May  7 10:21:12 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 10:21:12 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with  this?
In-Reply-To: <E1M246I-0003qQ-00@doehler.us>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<E1M246I-0003qQ-00@doehler.us>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A8@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: Joe Doehler

> I doubt that all that potential can be used with Yellowdog. Some web
> sites state that Sony locks out access to the SPU's when alternate
> OS's are installed, in fear that they could be used for cracking
> their games, but some people appear to have broken that barrier:
> http://www.physorg.com/news92674403.html

 Not exactly. Linux runs under a hypervisor on the PS3; it gets access
to the main CPU core (basically a PowerPC core at 3.2GHZ) and six of the
seven SPU's. (The seventh is used by the hypervisor.) You don't get
direct access to the hard disk, either, but you have some choice about
how much space you get.

 What you *don't* get is access to the "RSX", the graphics processor, so
no hardware-accelerated 3D graphics. Graphics is basically a glorified
framebuffer. (Some people found a hole that got access to it for a
while, but that was closed in later versions of the PS3's firmware.)

 The RSX, though, has 256MB of memory. People have figured out how to
use that as a fast swap device, effectively doubling the amount of RAM
available to Linux. This makes Linux a lot more usable. Now that that
technique is in Ubuntu out-of-the-box, I figure it's time.

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                       (313) 227-2317

 "Useless laws weaken the necessary laws." - Charles Montesquieu
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Thu May  7 11:43:53 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 11:43:53 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A0301B9.605@gmail.com>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> OK,
> 
> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
> 
> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should? Obviously
> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.

Microsoft snoops enough as it is already.
[It was from *spying* on IE users and discovering that many were
visiting travel websites which prompted MS to create Expedia.com]


From GregWojtak at quickenloans.com  Thu May  7 12:21:08 2009
From: GregWojtak at quickenloans.com (Wojtak, Greg)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 12:21:08 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <4A0301B9.605@gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A0301B9.605@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9FB6372000B099469B46478B643EE4696048F843@EXCCRVS1.mi.corp.rockfin.com>

It's not "spying"... it's "usage tracking!"  Microsoft told us so!

-----Original Message-----
From: mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org [mailto:mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Kulkis
Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 11:44 AM
To: MDLUG's Main discussion list
Subject: Re: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> OK,
> 
> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
> 
> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should? Obviously
> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.

Microsoft snoops enough as it is already.
[It was from *spying* on IE users and discovering that many were
visiting travel websites which prompted MS to create Expedia.com]
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Thu May  7 12:39:22 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 12:39:22 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Digital camcorders & Linux
In-Reply-To: <24535178.1241702344869.JavaMail.root@mswamui-valley.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <24535178.1241702344869.JavaMail.root@mswamui-valley.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3AA@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: R. Kannan 
> Can any of the open source application read/transcode AVCHD format?

 I'm kinda curious about that too, since we'll be looking into replacing
our aging camcorder soon. This looks like a useful link on that score:

 
http://www.fsckin.com/2008/01/03/transcoding-mtsm2ts-avchd-video-files-w
ith-free-software/

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                (313) 227-2317

 "If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear."
       - Slogan of the NKVD (forerunner of the KGB)
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May  7 16:08:39 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 20:08:39 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <9FB6372000B099469B46478B643EE4696048F843@EXCCRVS1.mi.corp.rockfin.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A0301B9.605@gmail.com>
	<9FB6372000B099469B46478B643EE4696048F843@EXCCRVS1.mi.corp.rockfin.com>
Message-ID: <20090507200839.0e894284@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Thu, 7 May 2009 12:21:08 -0400
"Wojtak, Greg" <GregWojtak at quickenloans.com> wrote:

> It's not "spying"... it's "usage tracking!"  Microsoft told us so!
> 
	And it's for your own good!
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm
Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From brian at dangerbacon.com  Thu May  7 22:52:08 2009
From: brian at dangerbacon.com (Brian)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 22:52:08 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with this?
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <6f64e9540905071952j18077d44o24d12f8730b86e20@mail.gmail.com>

I'd recommend that the first thing you do is install nethack.  Even
without access to the ps3 accellerated graphics the game is
beuatifully rendered in HD.

On 5/6/09, Ingles, Raymond <Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com> wrote:
> It looks like the latest Ubuntu has built-in support for the key PS3
> updates I want. (WPA support over wifi, and ps3-vram swap support.) So,
> I figure I'll be pulling the trigger soon and stick Linux on my PS3.
>
>  The only thing holding me back for now is the availability of a
> big-enough backup drive, but it looks like I can borrow one for long
> enough. I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
> project - a Forth interpreter
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) ) running on
> the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).
>
>  Does anyone have any experience with this? Any gotchas I should look
> out for?
>
>  Sincerely,
>
>  Ray Ingles                              (313) 227-2317
>
>  "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers.
>   You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions."
>                -  Naguib Mahfouz
> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It
> contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named
> addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose
> it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately
> and then destroy it.
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>

-- 
Sent from my mobile device

Brian
"It's not stupid, it's advaaanced!" - Tallest Purple


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Fri May  8 04:42:52 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 04:42:52 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with this?
In-Reply-To: <6f64e9540905071952j18077d44o24d12f8730b86e20@mail.gmail.com>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<6f64e9540905071952j18077d44o24d12f8730b86e20@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A03F08C.5080207@gmail.com>

Brian wrote:
> I'd recommend that the first thing you do is install nethack.  Even
> without access to the ps3 accellerated graphics the game is
> beuatifully rendered in HD.
>

Nethack is an ascii-game.
 
> On 5/6/09, Ingles, Raymond <Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com> wrote:
>> It looks like the latest Ubuntu has built-in support for the key PS3
>> updates I want. (WPA support over wifi, and ps3-vram swap support.) So,
>> I figure I'll be pulling the trigger soon and stick Linux on my PS3.
>>
>>  The only thing holding me back for now is the availability of a
>> big-enough backup drive, but it looks like I can borrow one for long
>> enough. I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
>> project - a Forth interpreter
>> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) ) running on
>> the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).
>>
>>  Does anyone have any experience with this? Any gotchas I should look
>> out for?
>>
>>  Sincerely,
>>
>>  Ray Ingles                              (313) 227-2317
>>
>>  "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers.
>>   You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions."
>>                -  Naguib Mahfouz
>> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It
>> contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named
>> addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose
>> it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately
>> and then destroy it.


From brian at dangerbacon.com  Fri May  8 09:40:21 2009
From: brian at dangerbacon.com (Brian)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 09:40:21 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with this?
In-Reply-To: <4A03F08C.5080207@gmail.com>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<6f64e9540905071952j18077d44o24d12f8730b86e20@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A03F08C.5080207@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6f64e9540905080640g7b198a03h17a48aef99cc2fe@mail.gmail.com>

Yes, it is :)

On 5/8/09, Aaron Kulkis <akulkis00 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Brian wrote:
>> I'd recommend that the first thing you do is install nethack.  Even
>> without access to the ps3 accellerated graphics the game is
>> beuatifully rendered in HD.
>>
>
> Nethack is an ascii-game.
>
>> On 5/6/09, Ingles, Raymond <Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com> wrote:
>>> It looks like the latest Ubuntu has built-in support for the key PS3
>>> updates I want. (WPA support over wifi, and ps3-vram swap support.) So,
>>> I figure I'll be pulling the trigger soon and stick Linux on my PS3.
>>>
>>>  The only thing holding me back for now is the availability of a
>>> big-enough backup drive, but it looks like I can borrow one for long
>>> enough. I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
>>> project - a Forth interpreter
>>> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) ) running on
>>> the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).
>>>
>>>  Does anyone have any experience with this? Any gotchas I should look
>>> out for?
>>>
>>>  Sincerely,
>>>
>>>  Ray Ingles                              (313) 227-2317
>>>
>>>  "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers.
>>>   You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions."
>>>                -  Naguib Mahfouz
>>> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It
>>> contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named
>>> addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or
>>> disclose
>>> it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us
>>> immediately
>>> and then destroy it.
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>

-- 
Sent from my mobile device

Brian
"It's not stupid, it's advaaanced!" - Tallest Purple


From danno at umich.edu  Fri May  8 15:00:53 2009
From: danno at umich.edu (Dan Pritts)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 15:00:53 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <9FB6372000B099469B46478B643EE4696048F843@EXCCRVS1.mi.corp.rockfin.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A0301B9.605@gmail.com>
	<9FB6372000B099469B46478B643EE4696048F843@EXCCRVS1.mi.corp.rockfin.com>
Message-ID: <20090508190053.GA62882@maniac.deathstar.org>

FWIW, I know of at least one open-source project (openafs) that
gets, and uses, the feedback from the microsoft automatic crash
reporter.

On Thu, May 07, 2009 at 12:21:08PM -0400, Wojtak, Greg wrote:
> It's not "spying"... it's "usage tracking!"  Microsoft told us so!
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org [mailto:mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Kulkis
> Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 11:44 AM
> To: MDLUG's Main discussion list
> Subject: Re: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
> 
> Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> > OK,
> > 
> > So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
> > 
> > At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
> > Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
> > option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should? Obviously
> > I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
> > I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
> > about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
> > are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
> > opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.
> 
> Microsoft snoops enough as it is already.
> [It was from *spying* on IE users and discovering that many were
> visiting travel websites which prompted MS to create Expedia.com]
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

danno
--
dan pritts
danno at umich.edu
734-929-9770


From lnovak1 at ford.com  Fri May  8 16:58:13 2009
From: lnovak1 at ford.com (Novak, Louis (L.M.))
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 16:58:13 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] adding wireless to existing network
Message-ID: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF04B@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>


Hey Folks,

I'm trying to add a LINKSYS WRT54G2 to an existing office network and am
missing
something I hope is relatively simple.

The wired network is an ATT DSL serviced network using 192.168.0.x with
the DSL
gateway at 192.168.0.1

I'm throwing away the auto setup on the WRT54G2 and trying to create a
wireless 
192.168.1.x subnet(?)

I can get on the wireless network but nothing makes it to the wired
side. Can't ping
the DSL gateway.

Netmask on both is 255.255.255.0  Is that the issue?

Thanks in advance for any advice or suggestions.

-- 
Louis Novak  lnovak1 at ford.com   (313)248-6788 
Ford Motor Co., IT Learning & Organizational Development
Eco-Tip: Bottled water is a waste of money and resources. 
Drink tap water from a reusable container instead.



From peter at petertheplumber.net  Fri May  8 17:24:01 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 21:24:01 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] adding wireless to existing network
In-Reply-To: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF04B@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
References: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF04B@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
Message-ID: <20090508212401.029c5007@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Fri, 8 May 2009 16:58:13 -0400
"Novak, Louis (L.M.)" <lnovak1 at ford.com> wrote:

> 
> Hey Folks,
> 
> I'm trying to add a LINKSYS WRT54G2 to an existing office network and
> am missing
> something I hope is relatively simple.
> 
> The wired network is an ATT DSL serviced network using 192.168.0.x
> with the DSL
> gateway at 192.168.0.1
> 
> I'm throwing away the auto setup on the WRT54G2 and trying to create a
> wireless 
> 192.168.1.x subnet(?)
> 
> I can get on the wireless network but nothing makes it to the wired
> side. Can't ping
> the DSL gateway.
> 
> Netmask on both is 255.255.255.0  Is that the issue?
> 
> Thanks in advance for any advice or suggestions.
> 

Dear Louis,
	While this link is from dd-wrt, it might have some usefull
	information.
<http://dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/Wireless_Access_Point> It sounds like
you're doing what I did, the guys here told me to turn off DHCP and
mine worked. More links to different configurations here
<http://dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/Linking_Routers>

Best Regards,

-- 
Peter The Plumber sm

Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From jbroughton at twmi.rr.com  Fri May  8 20:52:22 2009
From: jbroughton at twmi.rr.com (Jim Broughton)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 20:52:22 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] adding wireless to existing network
In-Reply-To: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF04B@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
References: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF04B@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
Message-ID: <4A04D3C6.6040209@twmi.rr.com>

Novak, Louis (L.M.) wrote:
> Hey Folks,
>
> I'm trying to add a LINKSYS WRT54G2 to an existing office network and am
> missing
> something I hope is relatively simple.
>
> The wired network is an ATT DSL serviced network using 192.168.0.x with
> the DSL
> gateway at 192.168.0.1
>
> I'm throwing away the auto setup on the WRT54G2 and trying to create a
> wireless 
> 192.168.1.x subnet(?)
>
> I can get on the wireless network but nothing makes it to the wired
> side. Can't ping
> the DSL gateway.
>
> Netmask on both is 255.255.255.0  Is that the issue?
>
> Thanks in advance for any advice or suggestions.
>
>   
If you plug the wan port into your
network anything behind the WRT54G has to be in another sub-net.
 If you choose unwisely to use the wan port you will have to setup ROUTING
within the routers settings (ADVANCED ROUTING) . You have to choose to set
the device as a router and not a gateway. Then make the appropriate 
settings to
get it to work. Can't remember what I did for those it was a few years ago.

 I did this once then decided it was a pain. So  now I just use one of 
the 4 switch
ports to plug into my main router (192.168.0.1). Everything is on the 
192.168.0.X
network, including the wireless.
BTW I have a WRT54G version3 not a G2.

Jim


From gib at juno.com  Fri May  8 22:39:09 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Sat, 9 May 2009 02:39:09 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
Message-ID: <20090508.223909.27719.1@webmail07.vgs.untd.com>


Well, take a scientific approach. Devise a hypothesis that can be tested and try it.  I would suggest that my hypothesis is that when submitting a bug report that a confirmation number (or ticket number) should be provided to check that status later. 

---------- Original Message ----------
From: bob dion <starline at wideopenwest.com>
To: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Subject: Re: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 10:09:20 -0400

Why give MS anymore ammo, than it already has, to screw with competitive 
products.

BD

Darwin Weyh wrote:
> I send them off but I doubt they will do anything but it will help to fill
> the database with Open Source Programs so maybe some Data Analysist will put
> it in a report someday.
> 
> Darwin Weyh
> Underemployed Computer Consultant
> Email: dcweyh at gmail.com
> Site: www.weyh.net
> Current Project: www.skillzdesk.com
> 
> 
> On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Robert Jim Fulner <fulner at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> OK,
>>
>> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
>>
>> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
>> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
>> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should?
>> Obviously
>> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
>> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
>> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
>> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
>> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.
>>
>> Yours in Liberty,
>> Jim
>> _______________________________________________
>> mdlug mailing list
>> mdlug at mdlug.org
>> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
> 
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


____________________________________________________________
Click to find information on your credit score and your credit report.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsHCkVTwcClU5LpdVzjQeZHLUwVkwCcZDF6OxQYlRWt8yIrEDvT7O4/


From gib at juno.com  Fri May  8 22:45:29 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Sat, 9 May 2009 02:45:29 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  adding wireless to existing network
Message-ID: <20090508.224529.27719.2@webmail07.vgs.untd.com>


Set the neighbor gateway.

Your using that at Ford?

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Novak, Louis (L.M.)" <lnovak1 at ford.com>
To: "MDLUG's Main discussion list" <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Subject: [mdlug] adding wireless to existing network
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 16:58:13 -0400



Hey Folks,

I'm trying to add a LINKSYS WRT54G2 to an existing office network and am
missing
something I hope is relatively simple.

The wired network is an ATT DSL serviced network using 192.168.0.x with
the DSL
gateway at 192.168.0.1

I'm throwing away the auto setup on the WRT54G2 and trying to create a
wireless 
192.168.1.x subnet(?)

I can get on the wireless network but nothing makes it to the wired
side. Can't ping
the DSL gateway.

Netmask on both is 255.255.255.0  Is that the issue?

Thanks in advance for any advice or suggestions.

-- 
Louis Novak  lnovak1 at ford.com   (313)248-6788 
Ford Motor Co., IT Learning & Organizational Development
Eco-Tip: Bottled water is a waste of money and resources. 
Drink tap water from a reusable container instead.

_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


____________________________________________________________
Simple and Easy. Click here to wipe out your debt in 12-36 months.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsDjqHrlEUilzcG7tjz0tgFbBLk83txBd4mb7fUOL8dFKnfiD0JOyU/


From driveray at ameritech.net  Sun May 10 14:22:33 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 14:22:33 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] SEMCO Linux SIG
Message-ID: <4A071B69.5040502@ameritech.net>

MDLUGers:

As some of you may already know SEMCO <http://www.semco.org/>
(the South East Michigan Computer Group) is forming a Linux SIG (Special
Interest Group).

The organizers have settled on the fourth Tuesdays of each month for
their meeting, in the meeting room of the Oak Park Public Library
<http://www.oakpark-mi.com/library/index.asp>


14200 Oak Park Boulevard, Oak Park, MI 48237
<http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=14200+Oak+Park+Blvd,+Oak+Park,+MI+48237&sll=42.46575,-83.19279&sspn=0.012236,0.035877&gl=us&ie=UTF8&z=16>

MDLUG is providing this SIG with a mailing list for meeting
announcements and organizational discussion
<http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/sig-linux/>

We all hope to see you there.

Raymond McLaughlin
President MDLUG


From mdbader at flash.net  Mon May 11 21:30:18 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Mon, 11 May 2009 21:30:18 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] SEMCO Linux SIG
In-Reply-To: <4A071B69.5040502@ameritech.net>
References: <4A071B69.5040502@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <4A08D12A.6090608@flash.net>

Thanks Ray,

Time is 6:45-8:45 pm
There is wireless Internet.

mike bader

On 5/10/2009 2:22 PM, Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> MDLUGers:
>
> As some of you may already know SEMCO<http://www.semco.org/>
> (the South East Michigan Computer Group) is forming a Linux SIG (Special
> Interest Group).
>
> The organizers have settled on the fourth Tuesdays of each month for
> their meeting, in the meeting room of the Oak Park Public Library
> <http://www.oakpark-mi.com/library/index.asp>
>
>
> 14200 Oak Park Boulevard, Oak Park, MI 48237
> <http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=14200+Oak+Park+Blvd,+Oak+Park,+MI+48237&sll=42.46575,-83.19279&sspn=0.012236,0.035877&gl=us&ie=UTF8&z=16>
>
> MDLUG is providing this SIG with a mailing list for meeting
> announcements and organizational discussion
> <http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/sig-linux/>
>
> We all hope to see you there.
>
> Raymond McLaughlin
> President MDLUG
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>    


From mdlug at wowway.com  Tue May 12 11:13:21 2009
From: mdlug at wowway.com (Dean Durant)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 11:13:21 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Medusa4 Cad?
Message-ID: <2134265949.5660881242141201510.JavaMail.root@md03.wow.synacor.com>

Has anyone used this? 

Ever since Dassault announced Catia would not be on unix, and pro-e pulled the plug on it's linux support, I've thought, there's a niche there. 

http://www.cad-schroer.com/index.php?ziel=Products-MEDUSA-M4Personal&ref=pr0903_m4p 

Impressions? 

Thanks, Dean 


From jhansonxi at gmail.com  Tue May 12 11:56:17 2009
From: jhansonxi at gmail.com (Jeff Hanson)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 11:56:17 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Medusa4 Cad?
In-Reply-To: <2134265949.5660881242141201510.JavaMail.root@md03.wow.synacor.com>
References: <2134265949.5660881242141201510.JavaMail.root@md03.wow.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <b02c40e90905120856n2726cdaex5c3096c2ed934cb9@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, May 12, 2009 at 11:13 AM, Dean Durant <mdlug at wowway.com> wrote:
> Has anyone used this?
>
> Ever since Dassault announced Catia would not be on unix, and pro-e pulled the plug on it's linux support, I've thought, there's a niche there.
>
> http://www.cad-schroer.com/index.php?ziel=Products-MEDUSA-M4Personal&ref=pr0903_m4p
>
> Impressions?
>

Never heard of it before although I'm aware of the other two.  It
looks interesting.  MEDUSA4's tool trays reminds me of M$'s "patented"
ribbon interface.

Most of my mechanical work is basic 2D, usually simple enclosure
designs for electronic products which I normally use AutoSketch for.
I just made a remodeling plan for a friends basement using QCaD.  It's
features are somewhere between AutoSketch and AutoCAD LT.  It's
probably not enough for what you need.


From fulner at gmail.com  Tue May 12 12:20:17 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 12:20:17 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] mdlug Digest????
Message-ID: <c768576f0905120920l16761e8dtd38ef6cf68b8cb83@mail.gmail.com>

So, like many of you I subscribe to the Digest, one day of getting new
e-mails from you all ever couple of minutes helped me change that, I like
y'all, but not that much :-)

However, I'm yet to figure out how the Digest thing actually works. Most
Digests I get are once a day, but MDLUG certainly isn't, as sometimes I get
4 of them,  and its not once it gets to a X number of emails, as sometimes I
get them with just one message in it.

Out of curiosity *what's the deal?*

Jim


From driveray at ameritech.net  Tue May 12 13:35:16 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 13:35:16 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] mdlug Digest????
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905120920l16761e8dtd38ef6cf68b8cb83@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905120920l16761e8dtd38ef6cf68b8cb83@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A09B354.7030707@ameritech.net>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> So, like many of you I subscribe to the Digest, one day of getting new
> e-mails from you all ever couple of minutes helped me change that, I like
> y'all, but not that much :-)
> 
> However, I'm yet to figure out how the Digest thing actually works. Most
> Digests I get are once a day, but MDLUG certainly isn't, as sometimes I get
> 4 of them,  and its not once it gets to a X number of emails, as sometimes I
> get them with just one message in it.
> 
> Out of curiosity *what's the deal?*
> 
> Jim

You should be getting one every day. We have recently had problems with
the server being down for days at a time. When we get it back up you are
probably getting several days worth at once. Also the are sometimes
stretches of several days with not activity. the there would be (I
think) no digest either.

Sorry
Raymond McLaughlin
Server Admin MDLUG


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Wed May 13 00:33:58 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 00:33:58 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] dia problem exporting to
Message-ID: <20090513043358.C828B20AAEC@starfox.local>

diagrammers,

Has anyone had difficulties exporting diagrams from dia(1) to svg?

os: linux-2.4
distro: centos-release-5.2
exec: dia-0.96.1 (built June 2007)

UML state machine diagrams appear fine on the screen
and when exported to .png,
but when exported to .svg, the text is about 150% too large for
the boxes and sometimes overwritten.

The latest version (Dec 2008) requires loading and building
at least ~20 dependencies on CentOS-5.2.

Is there a repository likely to have more up to date dia?

Does anyone know whether or not the latest version corrects this problem?

TIA,
-- 
Bob

  "In all science, error precedes the truth,
   and it is better it should go first than last."
     -- Hugh Walpole



From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Wed May 13 18:19:13 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 18:19:13 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [mdlug] Camcorder does not mount
Message-ID: <3091636.1242253153920.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Hello,

I have a new Panasonic camcorder with USB connection. When I connect it to my laptop running Windows, it mounts as a file system that can be browsed. When I connect it to the same laptop running Linux (SuSE 10.1, Kernel 2.6), it does not mount automatically and the camcorder display says 'connecting'. 'lsusb' does not show any new device.

Anything I can try to debug?

Thanks

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From jhansonxi at gmail.com  Wed May 13 18:25:06 2009
From: jhansonxi at gmail.com (Jeff Hanson)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 18:25:06 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Camcorder does not mount
In-Reply-To: <3091636.1242253153920.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <3091636.1242253153920.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <b02c40e90905131525g7b119fcbu55e1d2a169796b68@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 6:19 PM, R. Kannan <rkannan at peoplepc.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I have a new Panasonic camcorder with USB connection. When I connect it to my laptop running Windows, it mounts as a file system that can be browsed. When I connect it to the same laptop running Linux (SuSE 10.1, Kernel 2.6), it does not mount automatically and the camcorder display says 'connecting'. 'lsusb' does not show any new device.
>
> Anything I can try to debug?
>

No idea.  Search for the model number and Linux or Suse to see if
anyone else had trouble.  Also check the kernel messages (dmesg) to
see if any activity is noted.


From driveray at ameritech.net  Wed May 13 18:21:30 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 18:21:30 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Camcorder does not mount
In-Reply-To: <3091636.1242253153920.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <3091636.1242253153920.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4A0B47EA.6000109@ameritech.net>

R. Kannan wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I have a new Panasonic camcorder with USB connection. When I connect it to
> my laptop running Windows, it mounts as a file system that can be browsed. When
> I connect it to the same laptop running Linux (SuSE 10.1, Kernel 2.6), it does
> not mount automatically and the camcorder display says 'connecting'. 'lsusb'
> does not show any new device.
> 
> Anything I can try to debug?
> 
> Thanks

The command dmesg|tail might tell you something, as might tail
/var/log/messages.

Beyond that the only thing I can suggest is to see if the memory media
is removable from the camcorder, and see if you can read it in a card
reader.


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Wed May 13 22:34:05 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 22:34:05 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [mdlug] Camcorder does not mount
Message-ID: <29530887.1242268445809.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Not sure what the problem was the last time I tried, but now it works fine. 

Thanks to all who replied.


-----Original Message-----
>From: Jeff Hanson <jhansonxi at gmail.com>
>Sent: May 13, 2009 6:25 PM
>To: "R. Kannan" <rkannan at peoplepc.com>, MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
>Subject: Re: [mdlug] Camcorder does not mount
>
>On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 6:19 PM, R. Kannan <rkannan at peoplepc.com> wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> I have a new Panasonic camcorder with USB connection. When I connect it to my laptop running Windows, it mounts as a file system that can be browsed. When I connect it to the same laptop running Linux (SuSE 10.1, Kernel 2.6), it does not mount automatically and the camcorder display says 'connecting'. 'lsusb' does not show any new device.
>>
>> Anything I can try to debug?
>>
>
>No idea.  Search for the model number and Linux or Suse to see if
>anyone else had trouble.  Also check the kernel messages (dmesg) to
>see if any activity is noted.


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From mdbader at flash.net  Tue May 19 15:55:32 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 15:55:32 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for Compaq
 Alpha and Debian
Message-ID: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>

thanks

Mike Bader


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Tue May 19 20:19:03 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 20:19:03 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net> (message from mike bader on Tue, 19
	May 2009 15:55:32 -0400)
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
Message-ID: <20090520001903.06E3220AAED@starfox.local>

Mike,

I've been happily using
+ Matrox PCI  card in Intel? 32-bit Dell box for 6yr?.
+ nVidia AGP  card in    AMD 64-bit HP   box for 2yr.
+ nVidia PCI? card in  Intel 32-bit      box for 15mo.

Reporting,
-- 
Bob

    "An armed society is a polite society.
     Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
       -- Robert Heinlein



From billings at negate.org  Tue May 19 21:01:08 2009
From: billings at negate.org (Jonathan Billings)
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 21:01:08 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s)
	for	Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <20090520001903.06E3220AAED@starfox.local>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
	<20090520001903.06E3220AAED@starfox.local>
Message-ID: <20090520010108.GF27667@meson.local>

On Tue, May 19, 2009 at 08:19:03PM -0400, Robert Meier wrote:
> Mike,
> 
> I've been happily using
> + Matrox PCI  card in Intel? 32-bit Dell box for 6yr?.
> + nVidia AGP  card in    AMD 64-bit HP   box for 2yr.
> + nVidia PCI? card in  Intel 32-bit      box for 15mo.

I think he's talking about an Alpha, as in DEC Alpha.  Not an x86
chip.  

I can't say I can offer any suggestions, other than to buy a video
card of the same vintage of the machine, and hope someone has already
figured out how to make it work.

-- 
Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>


From starline at wideopenwest.com  Wed May 20 07:12:03 2009
From: starline at wideopenwest.com (bob dion)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 07:12:03 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
Message-ID: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>

Hi Everyone,

A friend of mine is looking to purchase a netbook or laptop with 
built-in G3. Anyone have any experience carriers or coverage they'd like 
to pass along.?

Would buying an add-on card be better?

Any other comments?

Thanks
Bob


From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Wed May 20 08:09:08 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 08:09:08 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
	Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: mike bader


> Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
> Compaq Alpha and Debian


From jcbender at bendorius.com  Wed May 20 09:56:46 2009
From: jcbender at bendorius.com (Joseph C. Bender)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 09:56:46 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>
References: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>
Message-ID: <4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>

bob dion wrote:
> Hi Everyone,
> 
> A friend of mine is looking to purchase a netbook or laptop with 
> built-in G3. Anyone have any experience carriers or coverage they'd like 
> to pass along.?
> 
	1.  You're effectively carrier-locked the minute you get a EVDO module. 
  Sprint and Verizon generally will not activate each other's devices on 
their networks as a "native" device.

	2.  For the GSM carriers, EDGE is *terrible* for any kind of data 
throughput and HSDPA coverage is still kinda spotty, no matter what AT&T 
will tell you, and T-Mobile is so far behind on their HSDPA deployment, 
it's not even funny.
	
> Would buying an add-on card be better?
> 
	Yes.  For a few reasons.

	1.  You didn't just buy a really expensive module that's a bear to tear 
out if it goes bad or change carriers.

	2.  The externals give you a couple of different things that make life 
nice:

		A.  They generally give you an external antenna jack, so if you need 
to use an external antenna, you can.  This has come in handy a couple of 
times.  The USB modules are also nicely remoteable from the laptop.  The 
Compass 597 that I've got comes with a 2" USB extender that's got 
stiffener wires built in.  The net result is that I can plug that into 
my USB jack and pan/tilt the modem widget to get the internal antenna in 
the most optimal position.  This beats trying to get the whole laptop 
positioned *just right* so the internal module's antenna can get the 
best signal.  I also carry a little rig I made up with a USB extension 
cable and a suction cup+hook so I can slap the module on a window or 
hang it up somewhere optimal if that spot doesn't happen to be near 
where I'm using my laptop.
		
		B.  They've often also got nifty bells and whistles, like built-in GPS 
that spits out standard NMEA sentences for use with mapping programs. 
With the Sierra wireless devices, there's a string you can pass to the 
module via modprobe that'll activate the port, and it shows up as a USB 
serial port in /dev.
		
	3.  Linux support.  I've run across at least one internal laptop module 
that really didn't want to play nicely with Linux, even though it should 
have.  If you find that the external modem doesn't work right, you can 
always exchange it in the time period provided.  I've had good luck with 
the Sierra Wireless devices over the last couple of years, though I 
haven't really done anything with their newest devices.  I like my 
Compass 597 on Sprint, it's been really solid, and the built-in GPS is 
really nice.  Developing a OpenBSD driver has been a royal pain for it, 
but it works decently in Linux.


	Carrier-wise, I prefer Sprint for mobile "3G" data.  Verizon is really 
nasty about their transfer caps, and they've dragged a couple of my 
clients through some rather trying experiences trying to get their data 
plans set up properly.  AT&T isn't even on my consideration list because 
of their HSDPA coverage being marginal and the customer service hells I 
and some of my clients have endured with them.  Neither is T-Mobile, who 
doesn't even consider wireless data any sort of priority.

Hope this helps.

-JCB


-- 
Joseph C. Bender
Chief Artifex
Bendorius Consulting, LLC
Network and Telecommunications Consulting
jcbender at bendorius dot com


From driveray at ameritech.net  Wed May 20 09:58:06 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 09:58:06 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <4A140C6E.40800@ameritech.net>

Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>> From: mike bader
> 
> 
>> Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
>> Compaq Alpha and Debian
> 
>>From what I gather, most PCI cards *should* work, though 3D acceleration
> almost certainly won't. 3D *definitely* won't work on Alpha for Nvidia
> cards. I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
> (http://www.alphalinux.org/docs/fbcon_faq.shtml) You can have it for
> free, assuming I can find it. I'll check tonight.
> 
>  Sincerely,
> 
>  Ray Ingles                                            (313) 227-2317

I have an old Voodoo card that might work. I have looked at Mikes
machine. I works OK in text mode but we haven't been able to get X
running. This is the latest Debian we're talking about here. The current
video card is an ATI of some sort, I think an early rage. Trying to
start X with any of the ati drivers resulted in a device not found error.

The output of lspci -vv named a frame buffer module for this device.
Loading this module (it was not loading on boot) and then starting X
with any of the ati drivers selected (in xorg.conf) still gave a device
not found error. Selecting framebuffer as the driver, without the module
loaded likewise gives such an error. (I writing this is all from
memory). Selecting framebuffer as the driver, with the module loaded
would light up the screen and lock the machine.

Mike might be persuaded to bring this machine in to the Linux SIG
meeting at the Oak Park Library next Tuesday evening. A topic has not
been yet determined.


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Wed May 20 11:25:46 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 11:25:46 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] MS patents OS crippling
Message-ID: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

In case you haven't seen this, MS has patented the tools for extortion:

"On Tuesday, Microsoft was granted US Patent No. 7,536,726 (it was filed in 2005) for intentionally crippling the functionality of an operating system by 'making selected portions and functionality of the operating system unavailable to the user or by limiting the user's ability to add software applications or device drivers to the computer' until an 'agreed upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make available the restricted functionality.' According to Microsoft, this solves a 'problem inherent in open architecture systems,' i.e., 'they are generally licensed with complete use rights and/or functionality that may be beyond the need or desire of the system purchaser.' An additional problem with open architecture systems, Microsoft explains, is that 'virtually anyone can write an application that can be executed on the system.' Nice to see the USPTO rewarding Microsoft's eight problem-solving inventors, including Linux killer (and antelope killer) Joachim Kempin, who's been credited with getting Microsoft hauled into federal court on antitrust charges."

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=7,536,726.PN.&OS=PN/7,536,726&RS=PN/7,536,726


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From driveray at ameritech.net  Wed May 20 11:44:03 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 11:44:03 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] MS patents OS crippling
In-Reply-To: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4A142543.7080903@ameritech.net>

R. Kannan wrote:
> In case you haven't seen this, MS has patented the tools for extortion:
> 
> "On Tuesday, Microsoft was granted US Patent No. 7,536,726 (it was filed in 2005) for intentionally crippling the functionality of an operating system by 'making selected portions and functionality of the operating system unavailable to the user or by limiting the user's ability to add software applications or device drivers to the computer' until an 'agreed upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make available the restricted functionality.' According to Microsoft, this solves a 'problem inherent in open architecture systems,' i.e., 'they are generally licensed with complete use rights and/or functionality that may be beyond the need or desire of the system purchaser.' An additional problem with open architecture systems, Microsoft explains, is that 'virtually anyone can write an application that can be executed on the system.' Nice to see the USPTO rewarding Microsoft's eight problem-solving inventors, including Linux killer (and antelope killer) Joachim Kempin
, 
>  who's been credited with getting Microsoft hauled into federal court on antitrust charges."
> 
> http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=7,536,726.PN.&OS=PN/7,536,726&RS=PN/7,536,726
> 

And, I think, prior art is trivial to find. A couple of weeks ago I got
some limited experience with DEC's TRU64 UNIX. My research lead me to
references indicating that system functionality depended on certain
license files (PAK files if I recall) being present and up to date.


From gib at juno.com  Tue May 19 07:55:25 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 11:55:25 GMT
Subject: [mdlug] i3 Detroit Meeting Every Tuesday
Message-ID: <20090519.075525.19352.0@webmail15.vgs.untd.com>

 
Just thought I'd send a note to let everyone know that i3detroit.com plans to have meetings every Tuesday.

Check the web site:
http://www.i3detroit.com/

---------- Forwarded Message ----------
From: i3 Detroit <contact at i3detroit.com>
To: Gib <gib at juno.com>
Subject: Re: i3 Detroit contact request
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 18:54:13 -0400

Gib,

Thanks for the thought. We will actual be discussing tonight moving  
the meeting to a new night based on other groups nights so that we can  
have people from other groups join us.

The meeting notes from tonights meeting will be posted on the site  
with meeting details. We hope to see you at our next meeting.

Thanks

Russ
Founder
Rwolfe at i3detroit.com


On May 12, 2009, at 6:34 PM, Gib <gib at juno.com> wrote:

>
> Gib wrote:
> Just a thought, don't schedule your meeting for the same night as  
> mug.org.
>
> Website: Meeting same night as mug.org
> IP: 66.51.146.158

____________________________________________________________
Best Weight Loss Program - Click Here!
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsEGrHXjglqNtXeEYT1TUHMDWgr6wodJARa9rqVBP39XAhtX3WHd1u/

From gib at juno.com  Tue May 19 16:02:08 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 20:02:08 GMT
Subject: [mdlug] Livonia Middle School Tech Expo - May 27
Message-ID: <20090519.160208.20265.1@webmail04.vgs.untd.com>

  
I saw a note about the Tech Expo that Livonia Public School is planning to do May 27Th. I asked if they want me to forward the information to the groups in the area. They do.

 
Subject: District Tech Expo - May 27


Hello Livonia Public Schools? Community,
Technology, Technology, Technology!!!  Everywhere we turn, every place we look and everything we do seems to be impacted by technology.   During the past year, students in LPS are doing some wonderful things with technology both inside and outside of school.  We would love to share some of these tools with LPS parents, staff and community members through an evening dedicated to exploring current and emerging technologies as LPS presents?
<?XML:NAMESPACE PREFIX = O />
Tech Expo 2009
?Communicating, Collaborating and Connecting?
Wednesday, May 27, 2009
6:00 to 8:30 p.m.
Holmes Middle School
 Sessions include..?         The NEW District Website?         Pinnacle (Parent Internet Viewer)?         Latest and Greatest in Technology (Skype, Twitter, etc)?         YouTube?         Social Networking?         Research Skills and Techniques using Technology?         Multimedia Tools?         And Much, Much More! The evening will end with a town hall style, panel discussion about the latest trends and issues in technology.  It truly will be an evening for you to ?catch-up? with what the younger generations are doing with technology.  Take advantage of this unique opportunity to learn about these tools FREE of charge!  More details are located on the district's new website at http://www.livoniapublicschools.org/files/calendar/techexpo.pdf

For more information, contact Carol Tinney at ctinney at livoniapublicschools.org

Hope to see you there!

Carol Tinney
Supervisor of Instructional Technology

____________________________________________________________
You have a right to seek justice!  Click here to find experienced lawyers across the USA.
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From akoper at ameritech.net  Wed May 20 12:19:06 2009
From: akoper at ameritech.net (Andrew Koper)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 12:19:06 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Selling software
Message-ID: <006301c9d966$b3cfee50$1b6fcaf0$@net>

I need lots of large lists of contact information for companies - all
different industries and geographic areas.  Dun and Bradstreet has a
database of the companies that make up the U.S. economy, but they charge $$
for that info.  Where and how can I get that information online?

 

Are there people on this list that have experience selling software to
companies?  I would like to take you out to lunch and pick your brain for
advice on how to do that.

 

____________________

 

Andrew Koper

Founder & CEO

work-flow.biz

PO Box 32838

Detroit, MI 48232

p: 313-554-1060

e: akoper at work-flow.biz

 

 



From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Wed May 20 14:39:34 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 14:39:34 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] MS patents OS crippling
In-Reply-To: <4A142543.7080903@ameritech.net>
References: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<4A142543.7080903@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3C0@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: Raymond McLaughlin 
> R. Kannan wrote:
> > In case you haven't seen this, MS has patented the tools for
extortion:
> >
> > "On Tuesday, Microsoft was granted US Patent No. 7,536,726 (it was
filed
> in 2005) for intentionally crippling the functionality of an operating
> system by 'making selected portions and functionality of the operating
> system unavailable to the user or by limiting the user's ability to
add
> software applications or device drivers to the computer' until an
'agreed
> upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make available the
> restricted functionality.'
> 
> And, I think, prior art is trivial to find. A couple of weeks ago I
got
> some limited experience with DEC's TRU64 UNIX. My research lead me to
> references indicating that system functionality depended on certain
> license files (PAK files if I recall) being present and up to date.

 Lots of mainframes had similar restrictions, too.

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                                (313)
227-2317

  "...it is largely unnecessary to trade civil liberties for security...
   the best security measures -- reinforcing the airplane cockpit door,
   putting barricades and guards around important buildings, improving
  authentication for telephone and Internet banking -- have no effect on
     civil liberties. Broad surveillance is a mark of bad security."
                           - Bruce Schneier
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From starline at wideopenwest.com  Wed May 20 15:04:31 2009
From: starline at wideopenwest.com (bob dion)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 15:04:31 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
References: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>
	<4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
Message-ID: <4A14543F.8030905@wideopenwest.com>

Thank you Joseph for detailed reply. I will be passing this info along.

I was leaning towards suggesting an add on card and your explanation 
will add some weight.

I was also going to suggest a Linux box, we'll see what happens there.

Bob

Joseph C. Bender wrote:
> bob dion wrote:
>> Hi Everyone,
>>
>> A friend of mine is looking to purchase a netbook or laptop with 
>> built-in G3. Anyone have any experience carriers or coverage they'd like 
>> to pass along.?
>>
> 	1.  You're effectively carrier-locked the minute you get a EVDO module. 
>   Sprint and Verizon generally will not activate each other's devices on 
> their networks as a "native" device.
> 
> 	2.  For the GSM carriers, EDGE is *terrible* for any kind of data 
> throughput and HSDPA coverage is still kinda spotty, no matter what AT&T 
> will tell you, and T-Mobile is so far behind on their HSDPA deployment, 
> it's not even funny.
> 	
>> Would buying an add-on card be better?
>>
> 	Yes.  For a few reasons.
> 
> 	1.  You didn't just buy a really expensive module that's a bear to tear 
> out if it goes bad or change carriers.
> 
> 	2.  The externals give you a couple of different things that make life 
> nice:
> 
> 		A.  They generally give you an external antenna jack, so if you need 
> to use an external antenna, you can.  This has come in handy a couple of 
> times.  The USB modules are also nicely remoteable from the laptop.  The 
> Compass 597 that I've got comes with a 2" USB extender that's got 
> stiffener wires built in.  The net result is that I can plug that into 
> my USB jack and pan/tilt the modem widget to get the internal antenna in 
> the most optimal position.  This beats trying to get the whole laptop 
> positioned *just right* so the internal module's antenna can get the 
> best signal.  I also carry a little rig I made up with a USB extension 
> cable and a suction cup+hook so I can slap the module on a window or 
> hang it up somewhere optimal if that spot doesn't happen to be near 
> where I'm using my laptop.
> 		
> 		B.  They've often also got nifty bells and whistles, like built-in GPS 
> that spits out standard NMEA sentences for use with mapping programs. 
> With the Sierra wireless devices, there's a string you can pass to the 
> module via modprobe that'll activate the port, and it shows up as a USB 
> serial port in /dev.
> 		
> 	3.  Linux support.  I've run across at least one internal laptop module 
> that really didn't want to play nicely with Linux, even though it should 
> have.  If you find that the external modem doesn't work right, you can 
> always exchange it in the time period provided.  I've had good luck with 
> the Sierra Wireless devices over the last couple of years, though I 
> haven't really done anything with their newest devices.  I like my 
> Compass 597 on Sprint, it's been really solid, and the built-in GPS is 
> really nice.  Developing a OpenBSD driver has been a royal pain for it, 
> but it works decently in Linux.
> 
> 
> 	Carrier-wise, I prefer Sprint for mobile "3G" data.  Verizon is really 
> nasty about their transfer caps, and they've dragged a couple of my 
> clients through some rather trying experiences trying to get their data 
> plans set up properly.  AT&T isn't even on my consideration list because 
> of their HSDPA coverage being marginal and the customer service hells I 
> and some of my clients have endured with them.  Neither is T-Mobile, who 
> doesn't even consider wireless data any sort of priority.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> -JCB
> 
> 


From lnovak1 at ford.com  Wed May 20 15:10:12 2009
From: lnovak1 at ford.com (Novak, Louis (L.M.))
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 15:10:12 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
References: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>
	<4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
Message-ID: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF0A3@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>


Any thoughts on the MiFi(tm)2200 Intelligent Mobile Hotspot from
Verizon? 

Looks like a neat device and has gotten some nice reviews:

http://gizmodo.com/5256825/verizon-mifi-2200-3g-portable-wi+fi-hotspot-r
eview

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/07/technology/personaltech/07pogue.html?_
r=1&em

-- 
Louis Novak  lnovak1 at ford.com   (313)248-6788 
Ford Motor Co., IT Learning & Organizational Development
Eco-Tip: Bottled water is a waste of money and resources. 
Drink tap water from a reusable container instead. 



From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Wed May 20 16:08:01 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 16:08:01 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] MS patents OS crippling
In-Reply-To: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4A146321.903@gmail.com>

R. Kannan wrote:
> In case you haven't seen this, MS has patented the tools for extortion:
> 
> "On Tuesday, Microsoft was granted US Patent No. 7,536,726 (it was filed in 2005) for intentionally crippling the functionality of an operating system by 'making selected portions and functionality of the operating system unavailable to the user or by limiting the user's ability to add software applications or device drivers to the computer' until an 'agreed upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make available the restricted functionality.' According to Microsoft, this solves a 'problem inherent in open architecture systems,' i.e., 'they are generally licensed with complete use rights and/or functionality that may be beyond the need or desire of the system purchaser.' An additional problem with open architecture systems, Microsoft explains, is that 'virtually anyone can write an application that can be executed on the system.' Nice to see the USPTO rewarding Microsoft's eight problem-solving inventors, including Linux killer (and antelope killer) Joachim Kempin
, 
>  who's been credited with getting Microsoft hauled into federal court on antitrust charges."
> 
> http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=7,536,726.PN.&OS=PN/7,536,726&RS=PN/7,536,726
> 

"until an 'agreed upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make available the restricted functionality.'"

In a closed source world, the technology to do this is trivial,
and therefore fails the obviousness test.

So it sounds more like a business methods patent to me -- all
of which were effectively rendered worthless at the appeals
court level last fall.  SCOTUS has allowed the counter-appeal
onto the docket -- I don't expect business methods to survive
their scrutiny, and software patents might get wiped out by
them, too, as both business methods and therefore algorithms
were allowed ONLY due to a peculiar ruling by a court back
in the 1990's, but in complete contradiction to both the
letter and the spirit of the Constitutional clause which
mandates that the federal government grant patents and
copyrights (the current duration of copyright ALSO violates
the clause which states "for limited periods of time" --
Life of Author + 20 years wasn't ever considered until
Mickey Mouse came in danger of falling into public domain,
and certainly not even during the early years of the country,
when life expectancy was below 50.

I doubt anyone will challenge this patent, though,
because it's worthless.  Even IBM stopped making
crippler-cards for their computers (the cards
would tie up the bus for a technician-selectable
percentage of the time) back in the 70's.  Getting
your mainframe upgraded (i.e. to higher throughput)
REALLY meant paying for an IBM technician to come
and pull the card OUT of the mainframe.


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Wed May 20 16:46:48 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 16:46:48 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Selling software
In-Reply-To: <006301c9d966$b3cfee50$1b6fcaf0$@net>
References: <006301c9d966$b3cfee50$1b6fcaf0$@net>
Message-ID: <4A146C38.7070601@gmail.com>

Andrew Koper wrote:
> I need lots of large lists of contact information for companies - all
> different industries and geographic areas.  Dun and Bradstreet has a
> database of the companies that make up the U.S. economy, but they charge $$
> for that info.  Where and how can I get that information online?
> 

One place to start is the stock exchanges:
NYSE (New York Stock Exchange), AMEX (American Exchange)
and NASDAQ (National Association of Securities Dealers Automated Quotations).

Every company traded on an exchange has to provide them
with a certain amount of information -- the names of the
officers, board of directors, and corporate headquarters.

All of this is in turn made publicly available.

I believe this hold true for both the national Over The
Counter exchange, and each of the 50's state's own state
level OTnformation -- the names of the
officers, board of directors, and corporate headquarters.

All of this is in turn made publicly available.

I believe this hold true for both the national Over The
Counter (OTC) exchange, and each of the 50's state's own
state level OTC.  For starters, contact the Michigan OTC.


From mdbader at flash.net  Thu May 21 08:01:19 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 08:01:19 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <4A140C6E.40800@ameritech.net>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<4A140C6E.40800@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <4A15428F.5020000@flash.net>



On 5/20/2009 9:58 AM, Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>    
>>> From: mike bader
>>>        
>>      
>>> Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
>>> Compaq Alpha and Debian
>>>        
>> > From what I gather, most PCI cards *should* work, though 3D acceleration
>> almost certainly won't. 3D *definitely* won't work on Alpha for Nvidia
>> cards. I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
>> (http://www.alphalinux.org/docs/fbcon_faq.shtml) You can have it for
>> free, assuming I can find it. I'll check tonight.
>>
>>   Sincerely,
>>
>>   Ray Ingles                                            (313) 227-2317
>>      
>
> I have an old Voodoo card that might work. I have looked at Mikes
> machine. I works OK in text mode but we haven't been able to get X
> running. This is the latest Debian we're talking about here. The current
> video card is an ATI of some sort, I think an early rage. Trying to
> start X with any of the ati drivers resulted in a device not found error.
>
> The output of lspci -vv named a frame buffer module for this device.
> Loading this module (it was not loading on boot) and then starting X
> with any of the ati drivers selected (in xorg.conf) still gave a device
> not found error. Selecting framebuffer as the driver, without the module
> loaded likewise gives such an error. (I writing this is all from
> memory). Selecting framebuffer as the driver, with the module loaded
> would light up the screen and lock the machine.
>
> Mike might be persuaded to bring this machine in to the Linux SIG
> meeting at the Oak Park Library next Tuesday evening. A topic has not
> been yet determined.
>
>    
I can bring it along. It isn't priority. We probably want to get 
organized and see how the groups wants to proceed.
I'm making a list of ideas, maybe an agenda of sorts, sign-in sheet. No 
hardwired Internet connection only wireless, unless we can rig something up.

Mike Bader


From mdbader at flash.net  Thu May 21 08:04:31 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 08:04:31 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>



On 5/20/2009 8:09 AM, Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>> From: mike bader
>>      
>
>
>    
>> Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
>> Compaq Alpha and Debian
>>      
>
> > From what I gather, most PCI cards *should* work, though 3D acceleration
> almost certainly won't. 3D *definitely* won't work on Alpha for Nvidia
> cards. I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
> (http://www.alphalinux.org/docs/fbcon_faq.shtml) You can have it for
> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.
>
> free, assuming I can find it. I'll check tonight.
>
>   Sincerely,
>
>   Ray Ingles                                            (313) 227-2317
>
>   "They say evil happens when good men do nothing. Well, the Democrats
>   prove it also happens when mediocre people do nothing." - Bill Maher
>
>    

thanks.
I have access to some cards, but it is hit and miss, and not certain 
that they work, and I may  have to go out and find drivers.

Mike Bader


From driveray at ameritech.net  Thu May 21 08:11:06 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 08:11:06 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>
Message-ID: <4A1544DA.3010107@ameritech.net>

mike bader wrote:
> 
> On 5/20/2009 8:09 AM, Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>>> From: mike bader
>>>      
>>
>>    
>>> Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
>>> Compaq Alpha and Debian
>>>      
>>> From what I gather, most PCI cards *should* work, though 3D acceleration
>> almost certainly won't. 3D *definitely* won't work on Alpha for Nvidia
>> cards. I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
>> (http://www.alphalinux.org/docs/fbcon_faq.shtml) You can have it for

>> free, assuming I can find it. I'll check tonight.
>>
>>   Sincerely,
>>
>>   Ray Ingles                                            (313) 227-2317
>>
>>   "They say evil happens when good men do nothing. Well, the Democrats
>>   prove it also happens when mediocre people do nothing." - Bill Maher
>>
>>    
> 
> thanks.
> I have access to some cards, but it is hit and miss, and not certain 
> that they work, and I may  have to go out and find drivers.
> 
> Mike Bader

Luckily the standard Debian install has a pretty good selection of video
drivers waiting to be loaded.



From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Thu May 21 08:32:50 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 08:32:50 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
	Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net><319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3C6@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: mike bader

> On 5/20/2009 8:09 AM, Ingles, Raymond wrote:
> > I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
> thanks.
> I have access to some cards, but it is hit and miss, and not certain
> that they work, and I may  have to go out and find drivers.

 Okay, it's a PCI Matrox Millennium. Should be around 4MB VRAM. Matrox
cards were always well-supported in Linux, so I think you should be good
- that web page seems to indicate so. (I also have a 4MB PCI Riva 128,
but I don't think that'll work on an Alpha.) If you want either, they're
yours, just let me know.

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                     (313) 227-2317

 "Imagine a cluster of Windows machines. They'd have to have a
    team of MCSE's equipped with roller skates, just to keep
           pressing reset buttons." - Peter Jensen
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From jcbender at bendorius.com  Thu May 21 08:44:04 2009
From: jcbender at bendorius.com (Joseph C. Bender)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 08:44:04 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF0A3@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
References: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>	<4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
	<4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF0A3@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
Message-ID: <4A154C94.6050402@bendorius.com>

Novak, Louis (L.M.) wrote:
> Any thoughts on the MiFi(tm)2200 Intelligent Mobile Hotspot from
> Verizon? 
> 
> Looks like a neat device and has gotten some nice reviews:
> 
	It certainly looks nifty.  I wouldn't mind evaluating one.

	From my PoV, it's one more device that I have to worry about keeping 
charged to be able to even get on the Internet.  I'd also be worried 
about the memory limitations of such a device, especially since it only 
appears to support five users, things that generate large numbers of 
connections, such as BitTorrent could easily overwhelm it.

	That being said, it's all educated guesses on my part as I haven't 
actually played with it.

	I've used (and generally prefer) the routers where you plug the modem 
widget into the router when you need it.  In a lot of ways, that's a lot 
more simple and flexible.  It also goes back to my carrier agnostic 
strategy as well, in that if you have to swap modems, fine, but swapping 
the whole router when going to another carrier is just silly.

Cradlepoint <http://www.cradlepoint.com> makes devices that do exactly 
that.  They do have the PHS300 (which yes, does need to be charged to 
use), but you can at least bolt the modem widget to your computer if you 
need to.  I don't own one, but I've used one that a friend of mine owns. 
  It seemed to work pretty well, as an end user.  :)

-JCB



From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May 21 11:42:15 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 15:42:15 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <4A154C94.6050402@bendorius.com>
References: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>
	<4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
	<4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF0A3@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
	<4A154C94.6050402@bendorius.com>
Message-ID: <20090521154215.2cf29d24@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Thu, 21 May 2009 08:44:04 -0400
"Joseph C. Bender" <jcbender at bendorius.com> wrote:

> Novak, Louis (L.M.) wrote:
> > Any thoughts on the MiFi(tm)2200 Intelligent Mobile Hotspot from
> > Verizon? 
> > 
> > Looks like a neat device and has gotten some nice reviews:
> > 
> 	It certainly looks nifty.  I wouldn't mind evaluating one.
> 
> 	From my PoV, it's one more device that I have to worry about
> keeping charged to be able to even get on the Internet.  I'd also be
> worried about the memory limitations of such a device, especially
> since it only appears to support five users, things that generate
> large numbers of connections, such as BitTorrent could easily
> overwhelm it.
> 
> 	That being said, it's all educated guesses on my part as I
> haven't actually played with it.
> 
> 	I've used (and generally prefer) the routers where you plug
> the modem widget into the router when you need it.  In a lot of ways,
> that's a lot more simple and flexible.  It also goes back to my
> carrier agnostic strategy as well, in that if you have to swap
> modems, fine, but swapping the whole router when going to another
> carrier is just silly.
> 
> Cradlepoint <http://www.cradlepoint.com> makes devices that do
> exactly that.  They do have the PHS300 (which yes, does need to be
> charged to use), but you can at least bolt the modem widget to your
> computer if you need to.  I don't own one, but I've used one that a
> friend of mine owns. It seemed to work pretty well, as an end
> user.  :)
> 
> -JCB
> 
	All very good and valid points. I'd have to double check the
	data limit's, but as is it's $20/month cheaper than any other
	data plan Verizon has. Maybe that's where they're going with
	this? I could easily see me hardwire one of these in my work
	truck to use. Matter of fact, it's only $10/month more than the
	crackberry data plan that I can't use anyway.
	I can see the return of convoys ;)

Best Regards,

-- 
Peter The Plumber sm
Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From gib at juno.com  Thu May 21 12:58:41 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 16:58:41 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  build-in G3 opinions
Message-ID: <20090521.125841.20365.2@webmail15.vgs.untd.com>

 
So, just an interesting thought.  I'm getting a new Blackberry that will use WiFi to connect for my voice phone use if available.  So, if many of us start to carry this MiFi thingy around with us we could share each others connection and reduce our minutes.  Since, several people at a restaurant sharing one minute for several conversations would cost less for the group as a whole.

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Novak, Louis (L.M.)" <lnovak1 at ford.com>
To: "MDLUG's Main discussion list" <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Subject: Re: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 15:10:12 -0400



Any thoughts on the MiFi(tm)2200 Intelligent Mobile Hotspot from
Verizon? 

Looks like a neat device and has gotten some nice reviews:

http://gizmodo.com/5256825/verizon-mifi-2200-3g-portable-wi+fi-hotspot-r
eview

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/07/technology/personaltech/07pogue.html?_
r=1&em

-- 
Louis Novak  lnovak1 at ford.com   (313)248-6788 
Ford Motor Co., IT Learning & Organizational Development
Eco-Tip: Bottled water is a waste of money and resources. 
Drink tap water from a reusable container instead. 

_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

____________________________________________________________
Click here to find the perfect banking opportunity!
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsKoDPprxwSj9tMLgGQ7jiNrs83TuTaSNJiopsTDEM3FTs733Ubjn6/

From gib at juno.com  Thu May 21 13:00:03 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 17:00:03 GMT
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
Message-ID: <20090521.130003.20365.3@webmail15.vgs.untd.com>

 
I'm getting a Blackberry and I wonder if you could explain to me your comment about the data plan.  I'm going to use AT&T.

---------- Original Message ----------
From: Peter Bart <peter at petertheplumber.net>
To: mdlug at mdlug.org
Subject: Re: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 15:42:15 +0000

On Thu, 21 May 2009 08:44:04 -0400
"Joseph C. Bender" <jcbender at bendorius.com> wrote:

> Novak, Louis (L.M.) wrote:
> > Any thoughts on the MiFi(tm)2200 Intelligent Mobile Hotspot from
> > Verizon? 
> > 
> > Looks like a neat device and has gotten some nice reviews:
> > 
> It certainly looks nifty.  I wouldn't mind evaluating one.
> 
> From my PoV, it's one more device that I have to worry about
> keeping charged to be able to even get on the Internet.  I'd also be
> worried about the memory limitations of such a device, especially
> since it only appears to support five users, things that generate
> large numbers of connections, such as BitTorrent could easily
> overwhelm it.
> 
> That being said, it's all educated guesses on my part as I
> haven't actually played with it.
> 
> I've used (and generally prefer) the routers where you plug
> the modem widget into the router when you need it.  In a lot of ways,
> that's a lot more simple and flexible.  It also goes back to my
> carrier agnostic strategy as well, in that if you have to swap
> modems, fine, but swapping the whole router when going to another
> carrier is just silly.
> 
> Cradlepoint <http://www.cradlepoint.com> makes devices that do
> exactly that.  They do have the PHS300 (which yes, does need to be
> charged to use), but you can at least bolt the modem widget to your
> computer if you need to.  I don't own one, but I've used one that a
> friend of mine owns. It seemed to work pretty well, as an end
> user.  :)
> 
> -JCB
> 
All very good and valid points. I'd have to double check the
data limit's, but as is it's $20/month cheaper than any other
data plan Verizon has. Maybe that's where they're going with
this? I could easily see me hardwire one of these in my work
truck to use. Matter of fact, it's only $10/month more than the
crackberry data plan that I can't use anyway.
I can see the return of convoys ;)

Best Regards,

-- 
Peter The Plumber sm
Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

____________________________________________________________
Get educated. Earn your college degree, 100% online. Click here for free info.
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From fulner at gmail.com  Thu May 21 14:45:38 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 14:45:38 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
Message-ID: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>

I have tried several times in the past few months, especially lately, to set
up Evolution to check my exchange e-mail from work. I have tried on XP SP3,
Vista Ultimate, and my home PC Xubuntu 8.10.

I have not been successful at all. I'm guess its my error, but it might not
be. On the Linux box, i've entered all the information, to best of my
ability.

my address is jim.fulner at parrot.com

I access my Web Account from https://mail.xi-lite.com/exchange

So I have entered that as my OWA URL as well as a few variations suggested
on various Linux Forum sites.

my user name I've tried both as jim.fulner at parrot.com and jim.fulner

on the Windows machine I never get pas the authentication step.

I was wondering if this has anything to do with the fact for the past
several months, at least 6, if I try to check my email via web I get an
error about how the website certificate is out of date, and I need to
authorize an exception and that good businesses should not require you to do
so. Of course, now that I'm typing this, I'm not getting the error on the
web to give you the exact wording, damn Microsoft.

So am I missing something else, is there a major PICNIC error that I missed
(problem in chair not in computer) or is this a communication error with my
exchange server?

-- 
Jim Fulner
Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
PO Box 252762
West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
715-419-0445 (cell)

http://www.lpocmi.org
Join our Group on Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts

"Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""


From jcbender at bendorius.com  Thu May 21 15:42:30 2009
From: jcbender at bendorius.com (Joseph C. Bender)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 15:42:30 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A15AEA6.8090700@bendorius.com>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> I have tried several times in the past few months, especially lately, to set
> up Evolution to check my exchange e-mail from work. I have tried on XP SP3,
> Vista Ultimate, and my home PC Xubuntu 8.10.
> 
	If it's Exchange 2k7 on the backend, it will fail hard.  You need a 
bolt-on for Evolution (the name of which escapes me) to make it work right.

-JCB


From micorral at comcast.net  Thu May 21 16:04:26 2009
From: micorral at comcast.net (Michael Corral)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 16:04:26 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905211601530.3095@banana.sluggo.net>

2009-05-21, Monsieur Robert Jim Fulner a ?crit:
<snip>
> Jim Fulner
> Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
> PO Box 252762
> West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
> 715-419-0445 (cell)
>
> http://www.lpocmi.org
> Join our Group on Facebook:
> http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts
>
> "Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""

WTF??

Michael

From billings at negate.org  Thu May 21 17:48:55 2009
From: billings at negate.org (Jonathan Billings)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 17:48:55 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <4A15AEA6.8090700@bendorius.com>
References: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A15AEA6.8090700@bendorius.com>
Message-ID: <20090521214855.GG27667@meson.local>

On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 03:42:30PM -0400, Joseph C. Bender wrote:
> Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> > I have tried several times in the past few months, especially lately, to set
> > up Evolution to check my exchange e-mail from work. I have tried on XP SP3,
> > Vista Ultimate, and my home PC Xubuntu 8.10.
> > 
> 	If it's Exchange 2k7 on the backend, it will fail hard.  You need a 
> bolt-on for Evolution (the name of which escapes me) to make it work right.

There's a newer plugin for Evolution that uses OpenChange
(http://www.openchange.org/) that uses the native MAPI protocol rather
than going through the exchange web client.  I doubt it's in *buntu
8.10 or even 9.04.  I plan to test it once Fedora 11 is released.

-- 
Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>


From mdbader at flash.net  Thu May 21 19:16:32 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 19:16:32 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3C6@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net><319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>	<4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>
	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3C6@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <4A15E0D0.9040304@flash.net>



On 5/21/2009 8:32 AM, Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>> From: mike bader
>>      
>
>    
>> On 5/20/2009 8:09 AM, Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>>      
>>> I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
>>>        
>> thanks.
>> I have access to some cards, but it is hit and miss, and not certain
>> that they work, and I may  have to go out and find drivers.
>>      
>
>   Okay, it's a PCI Matrox Millennium. Should be around 4MB VRAM. Matrox
> cards were always well-supported in Linux, so I think you should be good
> - that web page seems to indicate so. (I also have a 4MB PCI Riva 128,
> but I don't think that'll work on an Alpha.) If you want either, they're
> yours, just let me know.
>
>   Sincerely,
>
>   Ray Ingles                                     (313) 227-2317
>
>   "Imagine a cluster of Windows machines. They'd have to have a
>      team of MCSE's equipped with roller skates, just to keep
>             pressing reset buttons." - Peter Jensen
> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>    

Yes please, I'd like to give them a try

thanks

mike bader


From muteid10t at gmail.com  Thu May 21 19:59:49 2009
From: muteid10t at gmail.com (Ron Blanchett)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 19:59:49 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <20090521214855.GG27667@meson.local>
References: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A15AEA6.8090700@bendorius.com> <20090521214855.GG27667@meson.local>
Message-ID: <52995d720905211659w40eed24bs693fd10e42d6e25a@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/21/09, Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org> wrote:
>
> There's a newer plugin for Evolution that uses OpenChange
> (http://www.openchange.org/) that uses the native MAPI protocol rather
> than going through the exchange web client.  I doubt it's in *buntu
> 8.10 or even 9.04.  I plan to test it once Fedora 11 is released.
>
>
> --
> Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>
>

The new plugin is in all of the buntu's starting with 9.04, I have not tried
it yet though.


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Fri May 22 00:27:34 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 00:27:34 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <20090521214855.GG27667@meson.local> (message from Jonathan
	Billings on Thu, 21 May 2009 17:48:55 -0400)
References: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A15AEA6.8090700@bendorius.com> <20090521214855.GG27667@meson.local>
Message-ID: <20090522042734.D8B7720AAEC@starfox.local>

Jim, Joseph,

>> I have tried several times in the past few months, especially lately, to set
>> up Evolution to check my exchange e-mail from work. I have tried on XP SP3,
>> Vista Ultimate, and my home PC Xubuntu 8.10.

I've been using evolution for the last year with mail from our company
exchange system.  It has worked >90% of the time, but on several days,
it has been unable to pick up or send any mail.

The failure symptoms have included
  o headers read, but content pane remains blank
  o password dialog remaining open, and a "window not responding"
    dialog appears with the offer to terminate
  o evolution reporting loss of connection with exchange,
    re-established only after quitting evolution, running killev
    and starting evolution again
  o repeating any or all of the above several times
Over the last year, I have begun to associate the failure with
high network load, and the above procedures seems to merely occupy
time, until the net load drops.

Recently, I have noted that access via firefox is often instructive,
sometimes timing out as well, or sometimes supplying an error
message.

Though unproven, I have begun to suspect that when the connection
is lost, the exchange server remembers the client ip and
increases the delays in future connections (for about 24hr).
My coworkers use the word "rolling black hole" to refer
to a similar phenomenon.

My workaround is to wait until after business hours (or the
network load otherwise drops) before trying to restore a connection.

Hopefully helpful,
-- 
Bob

  "The real danger is not that computers will begin to think like men,
   but that men will begin to think like computers."
     -- Sydney J. Harris


From peter at petertheplumber.net  Fri May 22 03:22:25 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 07:22:25 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <20090521.130003.20365.3@webmail15.vgs.untd.com>
References: <20090521.130003.20365.3@webmail15.vgs.untd.com>
Message-ID: <20090522072225.75bd0c4e@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Thu, 21 May 2009 17:00:03 GMT
"gib at juno.com" <gib at juno.com> wrote:

>  
> I'm getting a Blackberry and I wonder if you could explain to me your
> comment about the data plan.  I'm going to use AT&T.
> 

	I use Verizon for now, they have two levels of data plans for
	Blackberry's. One; which I have; is $30/month and the other is
	$60/month in addition to the voice plan. I cannot tether and
	Verizon's TOS explicitly forbids it for my plan. I cannot opt
	out of these add ons, I must pay for one or the other. That's
	to much for me to swallow on top of a $100/month voice plan.
	What do they care what device I use for data, as long as I pay
	for it? That's what appeals to me about this router/modem. I
	can use any device I want. I should point out that Verizon
	puts their own firmware on the handsets they sell, except for
	smart phones. I gladly pay for
	the extra to gain some functionality that they disable in their
	other handsets. I will not be doing that much longer. I may get
	one of these router/modems. I will certainly; from now on; never
	take one of their handsets. I will buy my handsets elsewhere;
	to keep the functionality they program out; and possibly still
	activate on their network. I've had it with being tied into one
	or the other carrier. Verizon in particular intentionally
	cripples the functionality of the handsets they sell, so they
	can sell you add ons. I would be very interested in your
	experiences with ATT.  

Best Regards,

-- 
Peter The Plumber sm

Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From box at blogdetroit.com  Sat May 23 00:02:57 2009
From: box at blogdetroit.com (marytee)
Date: Sat, 23 May 2009 00:02:57 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Selling software
In-Reply-To: <006301c9d966$b3cfee50$1b6fcaf0$@net>
References: <006301c9d966$b3cfee50$1b6fcaf0$@net>
Message-ID: <4A177571.3050206@blogdetroit.com>

Well, you can try Hoover's -- http://hoovers.com/free/

Identify your demographic (alpha sort or by geography) then click the 
link to download the Excel file. You have a choice to pick the fields 
you want. I tested it and it seems to work.


Andrew Koper wrote:
> I need lots of large lists of contact information for companies - all
> different industries and geographic areas.  Dun and Bradstreet has a
> database of the companies that make up the U.S. economy, but they charge $$
> for that info.  Where and how can I get that information online?
>
>  
>
> Are there people on this list that have experience selling software to
> companies?  I would like to take you out to lunch and pick your brain for
> advice on how to do that.
>
>  
>
> ____________________
>
>  
>
> Andrew Koper
>
> Founder & CEO
>
> work-flow.biz
>
> PO Box 32838
>
> Detroit, MI 48232
>
> p: 313-554-1060
>
> e: akoper at work-flow.biz
>
>  
>
>  
>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>   


From amdavis at wideopenwest.com  Sun May 24 00:52:47 2009
From: amdavis at wideopenwest.com (Adam Davis)
Date: Sun, 24 May 2009 00:52:47 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] MS patents OS crippling
In-Reply-To: <4A146321.903@gmail.com>
References: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<4A146321.903@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200905240052.47534.amdavis@wideopenwest.com>

On Wednesday 20 May 2009, Aaron Kulkis wrote:
> R. Kannan wrote:
> > In case you haven't seen this, MS has patented the tools for extortion:
> >
> > "On Tuesday, Microsoft was granted US Patent No. 7,536,726 (it was
> > ... snipped ...
> > http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PAL
> >L&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=7,536,726.PN.&OS
> >=PN/7,536,726&RS=PN/7,536,726
>
> "until an 'agreed upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make
> available the restricted functionality.'"
>
> In a closed source world, the technology to do this is trivial,
> and therefore fails the obviousness test.
>
> So it sounds more like a business methods patent to me -- all
> of which were effectively rendered worthless at the appeals
> court level last fall.  SCOTUS has allowed the counter-appeal
> onto the docket -- I don't expect business methods to survive
> their scrutiny, and software patents might get wiped out by
> them, too, as both business methods and therefore algorithms
> were allowed ONLY due to a peculiar ruling by a court back
> in the 1990's, but in complete contradiction to both the
> letter and the spirit of the Constitutional clause which
> mandates that the federal government grant patents and
> copyrights (the current duration of copyright ALSO violates
> the clause which states "for limited periods of time" --
> Life of Author + 20 years wasn't ever considered until
> Mickey Mouse came in danger of falling into public domain,
> and certainly not even during the early years of the country,
> when life expectancy was below 50.
>
> I doubt anyone will challenge this patent, though,
> because it's worthless.  Even IBM stopped making
> crippler-cards for their computers (the cards
> would tie up the bus for a technician-selectable
> percentage of the time) back in the 70's.  Getting
> your mainframe upgraded (i.e. to higher throughput)
> REALLY meant paying for an IBM technician to come
> and pull the card OUT of the mainframe.
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

Well, I agree with your main point, that this patent fails the obviousness 
test. I also hope that these 'business method'-type patents are now 
worthless. But I'm not sure about your assertion that IBM has stopped using 
these kind of tactics. A few years ago when I was working on IBM midrange 
systems (variously known as System i, iSeries, or AS/400 computers), IBM 
restricted the 'interactive capacity' of those systems. These systems 
contained what they called an an "Interactive Feature", where if you paid 
IBM more they would allow your system to use a higher percentage of its CPU 
capacity for interactive jobs (5250 terminal sessions). This was ofen 
referred to as the "interactive tax". Exceeding the percentage you had paid 
for would kick off an OS-controlled job that would dramatically slow down 
your system.

So IBM could have a problem with this patent, depending on how its worded. I 
don't think its something they would want to challenge, however. I don't 
think they have much to gain by highlighting their prior art in this area.


From gib at juno.com  Sat May 23 22:49:59 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Sun, 24 May 2009 02:49:59 GMT
Subject: [mdlug] Need Help with MAc Screen Swap - Anybody Authorized to
	Repair Macs?
Message-ID: <20090523.224959.25896.1@webmail09.vgs.untd.com>

  	
Got this from a neighbor.  Anyone authorized to repair a Mac who could swap a screen?

:-)


Gibson,

Hate to bother you on this beautiful weekend.. . . . . .

Our son flew home this weekend and will be going back to California Monday, to finish his semester/and upcoming Finals.....  In the airport security he dropped his 15" MacPro, less than a year old Laptop, damaged the flip up screen.  Tom & Nathan went to apple Novi this morning and the best we can do is order a replacement screen, it will arrive tomorrow, Sunday.  Apple says you have to have it installed, to maintain our three year warranty.  I have used MacProfessionals in Novi before, but they only work Monday thru Friday, and since it is a holiday will not be open until Tuesday.  Therefore the plan is to take it there Tuesday morning, get it changed and overnight it back to California. 
Big risk, with his upcoming finals.........
 
I thought, maybe by chance, Do you have a Geek friend who may be authorized to swap the screen before 8 a.m. Monday ?  Just thought I'd ask......

Thanks, Sandy McKenty


____________________________________________________________
Learning Centers - Click Here.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsIpv1SqQJfPfj7yBUgx8rO6JvcGin9FtD0GTJkLp1lk1MAeTq5PgM/


From driveray at ameritech.net  Tue May 26 09:45:57 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Tue, 26 May 2009 09:45:57 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] SEMCO Sig-Linux meeting Oak Park Library 6:45 Tonight
Message-ID: <4A1BF295.80400@ameritech.net>

SEMCO Sig-Linux meeting Oak Park Library 6:45 Tonight
First meeting general discussion, organization and planning.

> mike bader wrote:
>> Where: Oak Park Library, 14200 Oak Park Blvd., Oak Park, Michigan. Oak
>> Park Blvd. is 9.5 mile road and the library is west of Coolidge. Ask at
>> the library about the room assignment.
>> 
>> When: 4th Tuesday 6:45-8:45pm
>> 
>> After the meetings some of us meet for a bite to eat at
>> 
>> O'Mara's
>> SW corner of 12 Mile&  Coolidge
>> 2555 12 Mile Rd
>> Berkley, MI 48072
>> (248)399-6750
>> www.omaras.net
>> 
>> Mike Bader
>> 
>> 



From Stan at mcomputersolutions.com  Wed May 27 20:29:49 2009
From: Stan at mcomputersolutions.com (Stan Green)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 20:29:49 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
Message-ID: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>

I know this subject comes up from time to time, but things change over time. 
(i.e. providers come and go.)

I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am not 
interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who I have been 
very happy with. However they seem a little high in price, $60+/month. I put 
up with the price to get a static IP address and allowed to run servers. I am 
moving my web site to a hosting provider, so I no longer need a static IP 
address or to run a server.

I am looking for good performance at a lower price point. Does anyone have 
experience with a good DSL provider. I'm OK with acting like a normal Windows 
users to get it set up. (I don't need to tell them I use Linux as long as it 
still work after setup.)

Thanks,
Stan


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Wed May 27 21:22:05 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 21:22:05 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
Message-ID: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

I have AT&T (1.5 - 3Mbps)and have not had any problems for past three years. I had one outage for 6 hrs during that time. But if you are looking for good knowlegeable support, forget it. The tech support does not know anything other than 'reboot the windows'

-----Original Message-----
>From: Stan Green <Stan at mcomputersolutions.com>
>Sent: May 27, 2009 8:29 PM
>To: MDLUG <mdlug at mdlug.org>
>Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
>
>I know this subject comes up from time to time, but things change over time. 
>(i.e. providers come and go.)
>
>I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am not 
>interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who I have been 
>very happy with. However they seem a little high in price, $60+/month. I put 
>up with the price to get a static IP address and allowed to run servers. I am 
>moving my web site to a hosting provider, so I no longer need a static IP 
>address or to run a server.
>
>I am looking for good performance at a lower price point. Does anyone have 
>experience with a good DSL provider. I'm OK with acting like a normal Windows 
>users to get it set up. (I don't need to tell them I use Linux as long as it 
>still work after setup.)
>
>Thanks,
>Stan
>_______________________________________________
>mdlug mailing list
>mdlug at mdlug.org
>http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From relson at osagesoftware.com  Wed May 27 21:44:02 2009
From: relson at osagesoftware.com (David Relson)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 21:44:02 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>
References: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>
Message-ID: <20090527214402.21283daf@osage.osagesoftware.com>

On Wed, 27 May 2009 20:29:49 -0400
Stan Green wrote:

> I know this subject comes up from time to time, but things change
> over time. (i.e. providers come and go.)
> 
> I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am
> not interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who
> I have been very happy with. However they seem a little high in
> price, $60+/month. I put up with the price to get a static IP address
> and allowed to run servers. I am moving my web site to a hosting
> provider, so I no longer need a static IP address or to run a server.
> 
> I am looking for good performance at a lower price point. Does anyone
> have experience with a good DSL provider. I'm OK with acting like a
> normal Windows users to get it set up. (I don't need to tell them I
> use Linux as long as it still work after setup.)
> 
> Thanks,
> Stan

I've used DigitalRealm since DirectTV dropped out of the DSL business
about 6 1/2 years ago.  They're linux friendly, offer static addresses
(if needed), reasonably reliable, and are local (Ann Arbor).

David


From dand at zifferent.net  Wed May 27 22:06:29 2009
From: dand at zifferent.net (Dan DeSloover)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 22:06:29 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink
	.net>
References: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <59050.10.1.1.111.1243476389.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>

I'm also with AT&T and use their 3Mbps service and I couldn't be happier.
In 7 or 8 eight years it's gone down twice unscheduled for a few hours
each time. I run my own web and mail server and all I had to do is contact
them to open up incoming SMTP (I route outgoing through their SMTP server
so that I don't get labeled spam.)

I've recently jumped into their Uverse offering which is all digital
phone, TV and Internet.

I won't go cable because they are such enormous douchebags about blocking
ports, running home servers and using routers and switches behind their
equipment.

R. Kannan wrote:
> I have AT&T (1.5 - 3Mbps)and have not had any problems for past three
> years. I had one outage for 6 hrs during that time. But if you are looking
> for good knowlegeable support, forget it. The tech support does not know
> anything other than 'reboot the windows'
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Stan Green <Stan at mcomputersolutions.com>
>>Sent: May 27, 2009 8:29 PM
>>To: MDLUG <mdlug at mdlug.org>
>>Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
>>
>>I know this subject comes up from time to time, but things change over
>> time.
>>(i.e. providers come and go.)
>>
>>I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am not
>>interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who I have
>> been
>>very happy with. However they seem a little high in price, $60+/month. I
>> put
>>up with the price to get a static IP address and allowed to run servers.
>> I am
>>moving my web site to a hosting provider, so I no longer need a static IP
>>address or to run a server.
>>
>>I am looking for good performance at a lower price point. Does anyone
>> have
>>experience with a good DSL provider. I'm OK with acting like a normal
>> Windows
>>users to get it set up. (I don't need to tell them I use Linux as long as
>> it
>>still work after setup.)
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Stan
>>_______________________________________________
>>mdlug mailing list
>>mdlug at mdlug.org
>>http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>
> ________________________________________
> PeoplePC Online
> A better way to Internet
> http://www.peoplepc.com
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>


----
Dan DeSloover
dand at zifferent.net



From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May 28 05:22:18 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 09:22:18 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20090528092218.0199ec66@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Wed, 27 May 2009 21:22:05 -0400 (EDT)
"R. Kannan" <rkannan at peoplepc.com> wrote:

> I have AT&T (1.5 - 3Mbps)and have not had any problems for past three
> years. I had one outage for 6 hrs during that time. But if you are
> looking for good knowlegeable support, forget it. The tech support
> does not know anything other than 'reboot the windows'

	I second that about ATT, except that tech support is getting
	more Linux friendly. The last problem I had over a year
	ago;with getting mail; was solved after I refused to reboot.

Best Regards,
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm

Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May 28 05:22:18 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 09:22:18 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20090528092218.0199ec66@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Wed, 27 May 2009 21:22:05 -0400 (EDT)
"R. Kannan" <rkannan at peoplepc.com> wrote:

> I have AT&T (1.5 - 3Mbps)and have not had any problems for past three
> years. I had one outage for 6 hrs during that time. But if you are
> looking for good knowlegeable support, forget it. The tech support
> does not know anything other than 'reboot the windows'

	I second that about ATT, except that tech support is getting
	more Linux friendly. The last problem I had over a year
	ago;with getting mail; was solved after I refused to reboot.

Best Regards,
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm

Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From audiotech50 at gmail.com  Thu May 28 11:40:31 2009
From: audiotech50 at gmail.com (Michael Rudas)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 15:40:31 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>
References: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>
Message-ID: <b67fb0380905280840x66b451abhc20983580a8e91b8@mail.gmail.com>

--- Stan Green wrote:

> I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am not
> interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who I have been
> very happy with.

Realize that no matter who your "provider" is, all provisioning
(hardware) is provided by AT & T.  They now have "naked" DSL for as
little as $20 a month.  I've been a customer for 7 years, starting at
768kbps.  I currently have 6Mbps service with them--I'm looking into
the new 18 Mbps service...

~~ Michael Rudas
    My home page: http://MRudas.2Ya.com
    My Protopage links: http://TinyURL.com/3wt54n


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Thu May 28 13:00:10 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 13:00:10 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
Message-ID: <14048061.1243530011040.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net>


-----Original Message-----
>From: Michael Rudas <audiotech50 at gmail.com>
>Sent: May 28, 2009 11:40 AM
>To: Stan at mcomputersolutions.com, MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
>Subject: Re: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
>
>--- Stan Green wrote:
>
>> I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am not
>> interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who I have been
>> very happy with.
>
>Realize that no matter who your "provider" is, all provisioning
>(hardware) is provided by AT & T.  They now have "naked" DSL for as
>little as $20 a month.  I've been a customer for 7 years, starting at
>768kbps.  I currently have 6Mbps service with them--I'm looking into
>the new 18 Mbps service...

Just out of curiosity, how much do they charge for 6Mbps or 18 Mbps service ? Do you actually get the advertised speed?
>
>~~ Michael Rudas
>    My home page: http://MRudas.2Ya.com
>    My Protopage links: http://TinyURL.com/3wt54n
>_______________________________________________
>mdlug mailing list
>mdlug at mdlug.org
>http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May 28 12:58:12 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:58:12 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <b67fb0380905280840x66b451abhc20983580a8e91b8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>
	<b67fb0380905280840x66b451abhc20983580a8e91b8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090528165812.2cd1db59@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Thu, 28 May 2009 15:40:31 +0000
Michael Rudas <audiotech50 at gmail.com> wrote:

> --- Stan Green wrote:
> 
> > I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am
> > not interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy,
> > who I have been very happy with.
> 
> Realize that no matter who your "provider" is, all provisioning
> (hardware) is provided by AT & T.  They now have "naked" DSL for as
> little as $20 a month.  I've been a customer for 7 years, starting at
> 768kbps.  I currently have 6Mbps service with them--I'm looking into
> the new 18 Mbps service...
> 

	Would the 18Mbps bandwidth be the one that is offered bundled
	as Uverse? If so, can it be ordered separate or must it be
	bundled? I'm curious to see what you find out and what the
	pricing is.

Best Regards,
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm
Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From fulner at gmail.com  Thu May 28 13:34:30 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 13:34:30 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
Message-ID: <c768576f0905281034l7bba2efbq9fea405e672965d5@mail.gmail.com>

My wife has an HP Laptop (not sure the model off hand) that she bought at
*cough Wal-Mart *cough. Before we were married (2007). As a typical Windoze
user she got really frustrated at it, (wasn't printing) and hit the device
and damaged the hard disk. Well at least that my assumption the unit stopped
dead in its track, wont' boot from the hard disk and when it attempts to do
so it just clicks really loud and repeatedly. I can boot from USB or LIve CD
(with about 20% of the time able to read/write mount her Hard Disk once in
X). So, I guess it gets here threw the day, she kinda likes Puppy. I've
never been able to get the wireless to recognize this way, granted I've
never been good with networking. If someone has a suggestion on getting that
working, I'd be willing to listen ever google search and forum post I read
is no avail. That being said that's not the main reason I'm writing.

As I've never switched components on a laptop before, only a desktop, I was
wondering what I need to be looking for at a functional, though fairly
inexpensive, hard drive for her. Does anybody perhaps have one lying in a
basement they could part with for a reasonable fee? Or at least point me in
the right direction.


From fulner at gmail.com  Thu May 28 14:22:50 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 14:22:50 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
Message-ID: <c768576f0905281122t2df47b61v386ce53e5e19512a@mail.gmail.com>

> If it's Exchange 2k7 on the backend, it will fail hard.
I've read that sevearl times and always assumed I had Exchange 2003, simply
because our default application at work is MS Outlook 2003. Looking back on
it now, that was a pretty stupid assumption as the two are propably
unrelated. I'm not sure how I'd determine that for certain. "My IT" guys are
all in France, so that's not very reasonable, and if I do ask them for this
kind of info via e-mail, or from "our computer" guy (the tech support
manager) I usally get a response along the line of:

"you don't need to know that, quit using that hippie freeware"
"uhm, its not freeware"
"whatever"

> There's a newer plugin for Evolution that uses OpenChange
(http://www.openchange.org/) that uses the native MAPI protocol rather
than going through the exchange web client.  I doubt it's in *buntu
8.10 or even 9.04.  I plan to test it once Fedora 11 is released.

What's the MAPI protocol? that sounds interesting. I'm thinking about
switching distros anyways, *buntu is beginning to bore me, and each time  I
"upgrade" it seems less functional and crashes more, I really like the new
Knoppix, and as such trying to find a good LXDE native distro, any
suggestions?

> The new plugin is in all of the buntu's starting with 9.04, I have not
tried
it yet though.

How would i go about getting that it doesn't automatically update, and I
thought I already had all of the evolution add on's per Synaptic.

> My workaround is to wait until after business hours (or the
network load otherwise drops) before trying to restore a connection.


Bob, most every time I try to access is "after hours" but as a fairly small
company >500, but spread out around 35 countries, there isn't really an
"after hours time"

-- 
Jim Fulner
Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
PO Box 252762
West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
715-419-0445 (cell)

http://www.lpocmi.org
Join our Group on Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts

"Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""


From tesral at wowway.com  Thu May 28 14:39:53 2009
From: tesral at wowway.com (Garry Stahl)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 14:39:53 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905281034l7bba2efbq9fea405e672965d5@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281034l7bba2efbq9fea405e672965d5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A1EDA79.1040405@wowway.com>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> As I've never switched components on a laptop before, only a desktop, I was
> wondering what I need to be looking for at a functional, though fairly
> inexpensive, hard drive for her. Does anybody perhaps have one lying in a
> basement they could part with for a reasonable fee? Or at least point me in
> the right direction.
>   

What size range?  Laptops are not scary as long as you take a few steps.

1:  Get the service manual.  They all open up differently.  Even the
same maker will change things drastically between models.  They should
be available as a PDF on line.

2:  A clear work area with a nice little cup for the tiny screws.

3:  Go slowly.  Haste makes doorstops.

Changeling a hard drive should not be major surgery.  They are not an
arm and a leg anymore. 

-- 
Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.

Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org



From billings at negate.org  Thu May 28 14:48:49 2009
From: billings at negate.org (Jonathan Billings)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 14:48:49 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905281122t2df47b61v386ce53e5e19512a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281122t2df47b61v386ce53e5e19512a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090528184848.GA30784@rhea.lsait.lsa.umich.edu>

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 02:22:50PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> What's the MAPI protocol? that sounds interesting. I'm thinking about
> switching distros anyways, *buntu is beginning to bore me, and each time  I
> "upgrade" it seems less functional and crashes more, I really like the new
> Knoppix, and as such trying to find a good LXDE native distro, any
> suggestions?

Wikipedia has a good MAPI article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAPI

I think there's an evolution-mapi package in jaunty that you need to
use it.  The evolution-exchange one uses the webmail component of
Exchange, which is what's breaking.
-- 
Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>


From radkins at impelind.com  Thu May 28 14:43:23 2009
From: radkins at impelind.com (Robert Adkins)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 14:43:23 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <4A1EDA79.1040405@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <20090528191332.ABABEC0C6@impelind.com>


Laptop HDs aren't complicated to replace.

There's a new computer store called Computer Direct on John R just south of
14 Mile between Wendy's and Firestone. They have a number of laptop HDs on
hand and will match or beat the prices of any other computer component
seller in the area.

They are a local Michigan company with plans on expanding to several
additional locations across South East Michigan. If you are going to buy a
new drive, give them a look, they intend on sticking around and investing in
Michigan.

Here's their website:
www.computerdirectcorp.com

-Rob


> -----Original Message-----
> From: mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org 
> [mailto:mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org] On Behalf Of Garry Stahl
> Sent: Thursday, May 28, 2009 2:40 PM
> To: MDLUG's Main discussion list
> Subject: Re: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
> 
> Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> > As I've never switched components on a laptop before, only 
> a desktop, 
> > I was wondering what I need to be looking for at a 
> functional, though 
> > fairly inexpensive, hard drive for her. Does anybody 
> perhaps have one 
> > lying in a basement they could part with for a reasonable 
> fee? Or at 
> > least point me in the right direction.
> >   
> 
> What size range?  Laptops are not scary as long as you take a 
> few steps.
> 
> 1:  Get the service manual.  They all open up differently.  
> Even the same maker will change things drastically between 
> models.  They should be available as a PDF on line.
> 
> 2:  A clear work area with a nice little cup for the tiny screws.
> 
> 3:  Go slowly.  Haste makes doorstops.
> 
> Changeling a hard drive should not be major surgery.  They 
> are not an arm and a leg anymore. 
> 
> --
> Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.
> 
> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes Star Trek mort. 
> Viva la Star Trek admiraetur The Olde Phoenix Inn 
> http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com Metro Detroit Linux Users Group 
> http://www.mdlug.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
> 



From gib at juno.com  Thu May 28 14:57:28 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 18:57:28 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  laptop harddrive
Message-ID: <20090528.145728.8356.2@webmail24.vgs.untd.com>

 
Yes.  I have an old laptop hardrive that I can sell you cheap. It's, I think, a 6 gig.  Can you give me, say $20 for it?
I will be at the Panara Bread in Dearborn Heights on ford Road just West of Beach Daily (East of Inkster Road).  I plan to arrive about 6:20 PM.  
Or you can meet me at the MDLUG meeting the second Saturday of the month.
Or you can find me at the MUG.org meeting the second Tuesday of the month.
I have a long list of other events through the weekend. See me Saturday at the DearbornHills.org picnic or the Cobra meet near Ford world headquarters.
Just reply back and we'll set something up.

---------- Original Message ----------
From: Robert Jim Fulner <fulner at gmail.com>
To: mdlug at mdlug.org
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 13:34:30 -0400

My wife has an HP Laptop (not sure the model off hand) that she bought at
*cough Wal-Mart *cough. Before we were married (2007). As a typical Windoze
user she got really frustrated at it, (wasn't printing) and hit the device
and damaged the hard disk. Well at least that my assumption the unit stopped
dead in its track, wont' boot from the hard disk and when it attempts to do
so it just clicks really loud and repeatedly. I can boot from USB or LIve CD
(with about 20% of the time able to read/write mount her Hard Disk once in
X). So, I guess it gets here threw the day, she kinda likes Puppy. I've
never been able to get the wireless to recognize this way, granted I've
never been good with networking. If someone has a suggestion on getting that
working, I'd be willing to listen ever google search and forum post I read
is no avail. That being said that's not the main reason I'm writing.

As I've never switched components on a laptop before, only a desktop, I was
wondering what I need to be looking for at a functional, though fairly
inexpensive, hard drive for her. Does anybody perhaps have one lying in a
basement they could part with for a reasonable fee? Or at least point me in
the right direction.
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

____________________________________________________________
Free information - Best Cell Phones and Plans. Click now!
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsI5pdj7QuYnoXhFwvJM5nyx4pPFw8fn0rVd5DgtP8KKqljjLRzMB6/

From fulner at gmail.com  Thu May 28 14:59:56 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 14:59:56 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
Message-ID: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>

She currently has a 55 GB, I'm sure I wouldn't need more than that as
she has not used up most of that already. If you ask my wife she'll
tell you she needs much larger, I'm sure. I tried to talk her out of
the 500 GB external, and she went ahead and got it 2 years ago,
currently with less than 10 gigs of stuf on it. (Not the least of
which is me backing mup my /home directory each time I upgrade,
without her knowledge of course).

>What size range?  Laptops are not scary as long as you take a few steps.

1:  Get the service manual.  They all open up differently.  Even the
same maker will change things drastically between models.  They should
be available as a PDF on line.

2:  A clear work area with a nice little cup for the tiny screws.

3:  Go slowly.  Haste makes doorstops.

Changeling a hard drive should not be major surgery.  They are not an
arm and a leg anymore.



-- 
Jim Fulner
Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
PO Box 252762
West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
715-419-0445 (cell)

http://www.lpocmi.org
Join our Group on Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts

"Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""


From tesral at wowway.com  Thu May 28 15:07:09 2009
From: tesral at wowway.com (Garry Stahl)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 15:07:09 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> She currently has a 55 GB, I'm sure I wouldn't need more than that as
> she has not used up most of that already. If you ask my wife she'll
> tell you she needs much larger, I'm sure. I tried to talk her out of
> the 500 GB external, and she went ahead and got it 2 years ago,
> currently with less than 10 gigs of stuf on it. (Not the least of
> which is me backing mup my /home directory each time I upgrade,
> without her knowledge of course).
>   

I have nothing in that range.  You also have to know SATA of EIDE.  They
are not interchangeable.  Getting the hard drive out it will be
obvious.  SATA has the narrow little plug, IDE is a wide one.

Find out what you need.  Get same, replace.

-- 
Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.

Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org



From dand at zifferent.net  Thu May 28 16:03:29 2009
From: dand at zifferent.net (Dan DeSloover)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:03:29 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>

Not only that every laptop I've worked on has an easy access panel (4-6
screws) to the hard drive bay and maybe another three screws to remove the
hard drive.

Garry Stahl wrote:
> Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>> She currently has a 55 GB, I'm sure I wouldn't need more than that as
>> she has not used up most of that already. If you ask my wife she'll
>> tell you she needs much larger, I'm sure. I tried to talk her out of
>> the 500 GB external, and she went ahead and got it 2 years ago,
>> currently with less than 10 gigs of stuf on it. (Not the least of
>> which is me backing mup my /home directory each time I upgrade,
>> without her knowledge of course).
>>
>
> I have nothing in that range.  You also have to know SATA of EIDE.  They
> are not interchangeable.  Getting the hard drive out it will be
> obvious.  SATA has the narrow little plug, IDE is a wide one.
>
> Find out what you need.  Get same, replace.
>
> --
> Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.
>
> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
> Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
> The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
> Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>


----
Dan DeSloover
dand at zifferent.net



From radkins at impelind.com  Thu May 28 16:12:34 2009
From: radkins at impelind.com (Robert Adkins)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:12:34 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
Message-ID: <20090528204244.76C04C0C6@impelind.com>


> 
> Not only that every laptop I've worked on has an easy access 
> panel (4-6
> screws) to the hard drive bay and maybe another three screws 
> to remove the hard drive.
> 

	Then you have been mighty darn lucky.

	Some laptops can be a bear to remove/replace the HD. Some require
taking off a half dozen screws to remove a few pieces of plastic off the
"face" of the laptop to then remove a few screws to get the keyboard off and
THEN you can look at the HD location.

	No two laptops are always going to be the same.

	-Rob



From driveray at ameritech.net  Thu May 28 16:22:49 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:22:49 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>	<4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>
	<6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
Message-ID: <4A1EF299.8060308@ameritech.net>

Dan DeSloover wrote:
> Not only that every laptop I've worked on has an easy access panel (4-6
> screws) to the hard drive bay and maybe another three screws to remove the
> hard drive.

Some access panels take as few as 2 screws. The additional screws often
secure the drive to a loading tray, and/or interface connector.

> Garry Stahl wrote:
>> Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>> She currently has a 55 GB, I'm sure I wouldn't need more than that as
>>> she has not used up most of that already. If you ask my wife she'll
>>> tell you she needs much larger, I'm sure. I tried to talk her out of
>>> the 500 GB external, and she went ahead and got it 2 years ago,
>>> currently with less than 10 gigs of stuf on it. (Not the least of
>>> which is me backing mup my /home directory each time I upgrade,
>>> without her knowledge of course).

If you get a new drive its hard to find anything under 80 Gig. Lots of
room for two operating system if you want to dual boot. Or, if your
going with strictly linux you still have lots of room for a second
"emergency" install on a "hidden" (not mounted) partition that you can
boot into to fix the first one.

>> I have nothing in that range.  You also have to know SATA or EIDE.  They
>> are not interchangeable.  Getting the hard drive out it will be
>> obvious.  SATA has the narrow little plug, IDE is a wide one.
>>
>> Find out what you need.  Get same, replace.

At 55 Gig it's almost certainly IDE, but do get the manual and check.

>> --
>> Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.
>>
>> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
>> Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
>> The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
>> Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> mdlug mailing list
>> mdlug at mdlug.org
>> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>>
> 
> 
> ----
> Dan DeSloover
> dand at zifferent.net
> 
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
> 



From dcl400m at yahoo.com  Thu May 28 16:39:16 2009
From: dcl400m at yahoo.com (David Lane)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 13:39:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Intel's new DG45ID HDMI High Def. Video mother board And
	LINUX
Message-ID: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I just saw an Intel mother board that has both HD Audio and Video I just got a Blu-Ray/DVD drive and I'm hoping that I can load Linux to run audio/video.

Any thoughts 


David C. Lane 



      

From jcbender at bendorius.com  Thu May 28 16:44:00 2009
From: jcbender at bendorius.com (Joseph C. Bender)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:44:00 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <4A1EF299.8060308@ameritech.net>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>	<4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>	<6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
	<4A1EF299.8060308@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <4A1EF790.6000002@bendorius.com>

Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> Dan DeSloover wrote:
>> Not only that every laptop I've worked on has an easy access panel (4-6
>> screws) to the hard drive bay and maybe another three screws to remove the
>> hard drive.
> 
> Some access panels take as few as 2 screws. The additional screws often
> secure the drive to a loading tray, and/or interface connector.
> 
	This is why buying non-crappy laptops is always a good idea.

	One of the reasons I only buy Thinkpads is that the drives are 
replaceable quite easily.  It's one screw to remove the drive/bracket 
and 4 screws to remove the disk from the bracket.

	Your average cheap laptop puts the disk in stupid or hard to get to 
locations to save on materials costs.

-JCB


From micorral at comcast.net  Thu May 28 16:41:13 2009
From: micorral at comcast.net (Michael Corral)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:41:13 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>

2009-05-28, Monsieur Robert Jim Fulner a ecrit:
> Mike:
> 
> What do you mean:
> 
> 2009-05-21, Monsieur Robert Jim Fulner a ?crit:
> <snip>
> > Jim Fulner
> > Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
> > PO Box 252762
> > West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
> > 715-419-0445 (cell)
> >
> > http://www.lpocmi.org
> > Join our Group on Facebook:
> > http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts
> >
> > "Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""
> 
> WTF??
> 
> 
> 
> WTF: This is my name, title, mailing address, slogan, etc, typical signature
> information. Is there something in here that doesn't make sense? Do you
> simply strongly disagree with libertarianism and as such was[sic] surprised to
> see it? (I remember once reading on Linuxquestions.org, or maybe it was
> lewrockwell.com, that ever[sic] member of the Linux community is eitehr[sic] a
> libertarian or a socialist). The Open Source movement, and the Libertarian
> Party are both based on a simple thing FREEDOM, as such wouldn't you expect
> Libertarians to be in the Linux users group?

Bobby Jim,

Your signature amounted to one big political ad. We try (not always
successfully) to keep politics off the MDLUG list. No one here cares
about your political views (or those of anyone else).

Michael


From tesral at wowway.com  Thu May 28 17:02:58 2009
From: tesral at wowway.com (Garry Stahl)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 17:02:58 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
Message-ID: <4A1EFC02.4010102@wowway.com>

Michael Corral wrote
> Bobby Jim,
>
> Your signature amounted to one big political ad. We try (not always
> successfully) to keep politics off the MDLUG list. No one here cares
> about your political views (or those of anyone else).
>   

<Ex Cathedra>  Then don't read his signature.  The Moderator is not
prepared to censor anyone's sig file, yours, or his.  Unless such a
matter is totally out of line (which this is not) I am, not going to
ding anyone on what they want to say under their name.

Be not offensive, and be not be easily offended.  I point out the second
phrase.  </Ex Cathedra>

-- 
Garry  Stahl  MDLUG List Moderator.

Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org



From tesral at wowway.com  Thu May 28 17:13:29 2009
From: tesral at wowway.com (Garry Stahl)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 17:13:29 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <4A1EF790.6000002@bendorius.com>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>	<4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>	<6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>	<4A1EF299.8060308@ameritech.net>
	<4A1EF790.6000002@bendorius.com>
Message-ID: <4A1EFE79.8040507@wowway.com>

Joseph C. Bender wrote:
>
> 	One of the reasons I only buy Thinkpads is that the drives are 
> replaceable quite easily.  It's one screw to remove the drive/bracket 
> and 4 screws to remove the disk from the bracket.
>   
I like that about them as well, but he has what he has.  You want to
deal with the issue you have, not wish to deal with the issue you want.


-- 
Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.

Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org



From audiotech50 at gmail.com  Thu May 28 17:32:51 2009
From: audiotech50 at gmail.com (Michael Rudas)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 17:32:51 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Intel's new DG45ID HDMI High Def. Video mother board
	And LINUX
In-Reply-To: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <b67fb0380905281432h4e86ad0eu2a36a907abc6d4f2@mail.gmail.com>

-- David Lane wrote:
> I just saw an Intel mother board that has both HD Audio and Video I just
> got a Blu-Ray/DVD drive and I'm hoping that I can load Linux to run
> audio/video. Any thoughts?

I'm thinking that it would be easier if you had posted the model number :-)

If all you're gonna do is audio/video, this will be fine--but the
Intel integrated graphics hardware is abysmal in general, slow and
lacking certain hardware features.  Adding a graphics card would help,
but that negates the value of the integrated A-V features on-board.

In this case, I would try to find an AMD-based motherboard with
similar features.  Even on-board graphics will be MUCH better--current
ATi and nVidia hardware, even integrated, runs RINGS around the
integrated Intel stuff.  A bonus--it's likely to be cheaper.

~~ Michael Rudas
    My home page: http://MRudas.2Ya.com
    My Protopage links: http://TinyURL.com/3wt54n


From micorral at comcast.net  Thu May 28 18:11:03 2009
From: micorral at comcast.net (Michael Corral)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 18:11:03 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <4A1EFC02.4010102@wowway.com>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<4A1EFC02.4010102@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281751210.6697@banana.sluggo.net>

2009-05-28, Monsieur Garry Stahl a ecrit:
>> Bobby Jim,
>>
>> Your signature amounted to one big political ad. We try (not always
>> successfully) to keep politics off the MDLUG list. No one here cares
>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).
>
> <Ex Cathedra>  Then don't read his signature.  The Moderator is not
> prepared to censor anyone's sig file, yours, or his.  Unless such a
> matter is totally out of line (which this is not) I am, not going to
> ding anyone on what they want to say under their name.
>
> Be not offensive, and be not be easily offended.  I point out the second
> phrase.  </Ex Cathedra>

Ok, Garry. I know you'll be impartial about this.

Michael

"[I]t's the philosophy of a snotty teen, someone who's read too much
Heinlein, absorbed the sordid notion that an intellectual elite should
rule the subhuman masses, and convinced himself that reading a few bad
novels qualifies him as a member of the elite."

  -- What's wrong with libertarianism, http://www.zompist.com/libertos.html


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Thu May 28 19:13:45 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 19:13:45 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281751210.6697@banana.sluggo.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<4A1EFC02.4010102@wowway.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281751210.6697@banana.sluggo.net>
Message-ID: <4A1F1AA9.2020009@gmail.com>

Michael Corral wrote:
> 2009-05-28, Monsieur Garry Stahl a ecrit:
>>> Bobby Jim,
>>>
>>> Your signature amounted to one big political ad. We try (not always
>>> successfully) to keep politics off the MDLUG list. No one here cares
>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).
>> <Ex Cathedra>  Then don't read his signature.  The Moderator is not
>> prepared to censor anyone's sig file, yours, or his.  Unless such a
>> matter is totally out of line (which this is not) I am, not going to
>> ding anyone on what they want to say under their name.
>>
>> Be not offensive, and be not be easily offended.  I point out the second
>> phrase.  </Ex Cathedra>
> 
> Ok, Garry. I know you'll be impartial about this.
> 
> Michael
> 
> "[I]t's the philosophy of a snotty teen, someone who's read too much
> Heinlein, absorbed the sordid notion that an intellectual elite should
> rule the subhuman masses, and convinced himself that reading a few bad
> novels qualifies him as a member of the elite."


> 
>   -- What's wrong with libertarianism, http://www.zompist.com/libertos.html


Libertarians don't believe in any "elite" to be a member of.
It's the socialists who believe in an elite vanguard.

 -- me on what's wrong with zompist's view on libertarianism.


From jhansonxi at gmail.com  Thu May 28 19:39:26 2009
From: jhansonxi at gmail.com (Jeff Hanson)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 19:39:26 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Intel's new DG45ID HDMI High Def. Video mother board
	And LINUX
In-Reply-To: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <b02c40e90905281639y2fadf1adg4f08876bd0fff0ed@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 4:39 PM, David Lane <dcl400m at yahoo.com> wrote:
> I just saw an Intel mother board that has both HD Audio and Video I just got a Blu-Ray/DVD drive and I'm hoping that I can load Linux to run audio/video.
>
> Any thoughts
>

The video drivers for Intel are a real mess currently due to the
changes in X.org they haven't kept up with:

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReinhardTartler/X/RevertingIntelDriverTo2.4

Intel is pushing for the changes, especially for integrated video, so
it's partly their fault.


From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May 28 20:29:57 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 20:29:57 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <14048061.1243530011040.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <14048061.1243530011040.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <1243556997.8625.282.camel@plumber-notebook.site>

On Thu, 2009-05-28 at 13:00 -0400, R. Kannan wrote:
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Michael Rudas <audiotech50 at gmail.com>
> >Sent: May 28, 2009 11:40 AM
> >To: Stan at mcomputersolutions.com, 

<snip>

> >Realize that no matter who your "provider" is, all provisioning
> >(hardware) is provided by AT & T.  They now have "naked" DSL for as
> >little as $20 a month.  I've been a customer for 7 years, starting at
> >768kbps.  I currently have 6Mbps service with them--I'm looking into
> >the new 18 Mbps service...
> 
> Just out of curiosity, how much do they charge for 6Mbps or 18 Mbps service ? Do you actually get the advertised speed?
> >
I have the DSL-Elite package which lists the speeds as Downstream Speed:
3 Mbps - Up to 6 Mbps Upstream Speed: Up to 512 Kbps. Cost is $35/month.
Speed was 608Mbps outbound, 5.08Mbps inbound, measured at
<http://speedtest.umflint.edu/> just now. 

Best Regards,

-- 
Peter Bart <peter at petertheplumber.net>
Peter The Plumber



From dcl400m at yahoo.com  Thu May 28 22:07:38 2009
From: dcl400m at yahoo.com (David Lane)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 19:07:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Intel's new DG45ID HDMI High Def. Video mother board
	And LINUX
In-Reply-To: <b67fb0380905281432h4e86ad0eu2a36a907abc6d4f2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<b67fb0380905281432h4e86ad0eu2a36a907abc6d4f2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <392641.74787.qm@web37906.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Here it is on new Egg for $99: it is the BOXDG45ID

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121355

David C. Lane 





________________________________
From: Michael Rudas <audiotech50 at gmail.com>
To: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Sent: Thursday, May 28, 2009 5:32:51 PM
Subject: Re: [mdlug] Intel's new DG45ID HDMI High Def. Video mother board And LINUX

-- David Lane wrote:
> I just saw an Intel mother board that has both HD Audio and Video I just
> got a Blu-Ray/DVD drive and I'm hoping that I can load Linux to run
> audio/video. Any thoughts?

I'm thinking that it would be easier if you had posted the model number :-)

If all you're gonna do is audio/video, this will be fine--but the
Intel integrated graphics hardware is abysmal in general, slow and
lacking certain hardware features.  Adding a graphics card would help,
but that negates the value of the integrated A-V features on-board.

In this case, I would try to find an AMD-based motherboard with
similar features.  Even on-board graphics will be MUCH better--current
ATi and nVidia hardware, even integrated, runs RINGS around the
integrated Intel stuff.  A bonus--it's likely to be cheaper.

~~ Michael Rudas
    My home page: http://MRudas.2Ya.com
    My Protopage links: http://TinyURL.com/3wt54n
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug



      

From jcbender at bendorius.com  Thu May 28 23:06:52 2009
From: jcbender at bendorius.com (Joseph C. Bender)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 23:06:52 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <4A1EFE79.8040507@wowway.com>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>	<4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>	<6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>	<4A1EF299.8060308@ameritech.net>	<4A1EF790.6000002@bendorius.com>
	<4A1EFE79.8040507@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <4A1F514C.2040405@bendorius.com>

Garry Stahl wrote:

> I like that about them as well, but he has what he has.  You want to
> deal with the issue you have, not wish to deal with the issue you want.
> 
> 
	Gee, you think?  I didn't tell him he sucks because of the laptop he's 
got, just why I prefer what I do.  Don't read too much into what I'm 
saying, you might hurt yourself.

	Go spend your time lecturing to someone else, I don't want to hear it.

-JCB


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Thu May 28 23:11:27 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 23:11:27 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905281122t2df47b61v386ce53e5e19512a@mail.gmail.com>
	(message from Robert Jim Fulner on Thu, 28 May 2009 14:22:50 -0400)
References: <c768576f0905281122t2df47b61v386ce53e5e19512a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090529031127.1A05620AAEC@starfox.local>

Jon, Ron, Joseph, Jim,

> There's a newer plugin for Evolution that uses OpenChange
> (http://www.openchange.org/) that uses the native MAPI protocol ...

Installed and so far, working well.

Thank you,
-- 
Bob

  "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."
     -- Albert Einstein



From fulner at gmail.com  Thu May 28 23:58:39 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 23:58:39 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
Message-ID: <c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>

I appologize and I assure you that I meant no disrespect to anyone. The
simple comment "WTF" certainly threw me off guard. A better response would
have been to politely note that my signature was considerd political and as
such it would be preferred to not be included in an MDLUG post as per
policy.

In the future I assure you that I will attempt to remember to delete my
siganture from posts to MDLUG. (Almost forgot to do so just in this one).

BTW: . "No one here cares
about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
opinion of each and every one of you.

Yours truly,
Jim Fulner
DetroitLIbertyPenguin

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 4:41 PM, Michael Corral <micorral at comcast.net>wrote:

> 2009-05-28, Monsieur Robert Jim Fulner a ecrit:
>
>> Mike:
>>
>> What do you mean:
>>
>> 2009-05-21, Monsieur Robert Jim Fulner a ?crit:
>> <snip>
>> > Jim Fulner
>> > Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
>> > PO Box 252762
>> > West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
>> > 715-419-0445 (cell)
>> >
>> > http://www.lpocmi.org
>> > Join our Group on Facebook:
>> > http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts
>> >
>> > "Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""
>>
>> WTF??
>>
>>
>>
>> WTF: This is my name, title, mailing address, slogan, etc, typical
>> signature
>> information. Is there something in here that doesn't make sense? Do you
>> simply strongly disagree with libertarianism and as such was[sic]
>> surprised to
>> see it? (I remember once reading on Linuxquestions.org, or maybe it was
>> lewrockwell.com, that ever[sic] member of the Linux community is
>> eitehr[sic] a
>> libertarian or a socialist). The Open Source movement, and the Libertarian
>> Party are both based on a simple thing FREEDOM, as such wouldn't you
>> expect
>> Libertarians to be in the Linux users group?
>>
>
> Bobby Jim,
>
> Your signature amounted to one big political ad. We try (not always
> successfully) to keep politics off the MDLUG list. No one here cares
> about your political views (or those of anyone else).
>
> Michael
>


From fulner at gmail.com  Fri May 29 02:30:13 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 02:30:13 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
Message-ID: <c768576f0905282330i132e2761mfda81ab78c3edf80@mail.gmail.com>

Bob et. al:
I'm still not sure what i'm doing wrong. I've spent the last couple hours
working on this again. Installed evolution-mapi via apt-get
Didn't notice any differnt options according to
http://ww.go-evolution.org/MAPI_FAQ I should have a MAPI plugin available to
enable under EDIT -> plugins to activate
Granted I spent quite a bit of time trying to indentify my exchange server
per those instructions as well as an idap browser is a new idea in and of
itself to me...
>> There's a newer plugin for Evolution that uses OpenChange
>> (http://www.openchange.org/) that uses the native MAPI protocol ...
>
>Installed and so far, working well.
>
>Thank you,
--
Bob

 "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."
  -- Albert Einstein


-- 
Jim Fulner


From gib at juno.com  Fri May 29 08:06:16 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 12:06:16 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  OT: Good DSL Provider? AT&T good DSL, poor service
Message-ID: <20090529.080616.5014.0@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>

 
I've been happy with AT&T. I just upgraded to the Uvers 10Mpbs.  The install techs seemed knowledgeable but a second install tech corrected a problem from the first.  I'm left with a really odd set-up. My experience was that a poor scheduling back office procedure inconvenienced me twice (two days in a row I was given a time that differed from what the tech was told). 
The next day after the install the battery on the battery back up failed. (Why would you make a battery back up not allow the device to work when you have power?) A call to the help desk was extremely poor quality support.  The help desk person tried to go through a procedure without any understanding of the issue.  She tried to connect up to the 2-Wire device when I told her that it had no power.  

---------- Original Message ----------
From: Peter Bart <peter at petertheplumber.net>
To: mdlug at mdlug.org
Cc: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Subject: Re: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 09:22:18 +0000

On Wed, 27 May 2009 21:22:05 -0400 (EDT)
"R. Kannan" <rkannan at peoplepc.com> wrote:

> I have AT&T (1.5 - 3Mbps)and have not had any problems for past three
> years. I had one outage for 6 hrs during that time. But if you are
> looking for good knowlegeable support, forget it. The tech support
> does not know anything other than 'reboot the windows'

I second that about ATT, except that tech support is getting
more Linux friendly. The last problem I had over a year
ago;with getting mail; was solved after I refused to reboot.

Best Regards,
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm

Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

____________________________________________________________
Inventors: Does your idea have potential for millions? Click for info.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsFRu588wvZpx2xkivKVhTWT2k1l6fVit3OZDMdXIkYQ9djZxZxNyI/

From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Fri May 29 10:42:24 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 10:42:24 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3D7@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: Robert Jim Fulner

> In the future I assure you that I will attempt to remember to delete
my
> siganture from posts to MDLUG. (Almost forgot to do so just in this
one).

 No need. I've never worried about it and I've got some fairly pointed
ones.

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                   (313) 227-2317

  "No federal income tax was assessed before 1913, because
  government didn't require the kind of dough it needs now
         that it's running a concierge business."
 - Bill Maher, "When You Ride Alone You Ride With bin Laden"
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From danno at umich.edu  Fri May 29 13:01:44 2009
From: danno at umich.edu (Dan Pritts)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 13:01:44 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> BTW: . "No one here cares
> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
> opinion of each and every one of you.

It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.

If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
care what you have in your signature file.  

> Yours truly,
> Jim Fulner
> DetroitLIbertyPenguin

regards

danno

dan pritts
annarborguntotinliberalapplefanboy
NRA Member (amendment 2)
ACLU Member (the other 9)


From billings at negate.org  Fri May 29 14:02:19 2009
From: billings at negate.org (Jonathan Billings)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 14:02:19 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090529180219.GA18059@rhea.lsait.lsa.umich.edu>

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> In the future I assure you that I will attempt to remember to delete my
> siganture from posts to MDLUG. (Almost forgot to do so just in this one).

It'd probably be enough (for me) to just have a '--' alone on a line
before your sig, so my mailer knew it was a signature and can color it
differently than the body of your text.

I used to have a script that ran in procmail to replace certain
people's email signature because of how obnoxious they'd be.  For
example, my wife's company's email system added on a 2 page legal
disclaimer automatically, which I'd chop off before it landed in my
mailbox.  (I sometimes wonder what their legal department would think
of that...)

-- 
Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>


From micorral at comcast.net  Fri May 29 16:09:09 2009
From: micorral at comcast.net (Michael Corral)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 16:09:09 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>

2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>
> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>
> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
> care what you have in your signature file.

Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.

For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).

Michael


From cvweiss at gmail.com  Fri May 29 16:17:08 2009
From: cvweiss at gmail.com (Clinton Weiss)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 16:17:08 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
Message-ID: <4A2042C4.7090406@gmail.com>

So... with this annoying thread going on, I decided to try and revisit 
an old pet peeve of mine, Thunderbird's inability to ignore/watch a 
thread.  Seems someone once created an add on for this purpose, but it's 
no longer supported.  Does anyone have or know of an extension that will 
do this?  Or can you recommend an open source client that integrates 
well with IMAP that will do this as well?

<rant>
Once upon a time, we'll call it the 90's, I used an email/newsgroup 
client called Forte Agent, and it's ability to ignore threads on the 
newsgroups was just awesome sauce all the way.  It was as simple as 
typing "I" for any message on the thread, and from then on every message 
in the thread would be automatically marked read and skipped.  Why many 
good (aka Thunderbird) modern clients don't have this feature is beyond me.
</rant>

Clinton

--
signature removed, as it might advertise my identity :)


From driveray at ameritech.net  Fri May 29 18:37:12 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 18:37:12 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>
Message-ID: <4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>

Michael Corral wrote:
> 2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
>> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>>
>> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
>> care what you have in your signature file.
> 
> Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
> for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
> Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
> should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
> a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.
> 
> For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
> on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
> but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
> his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).
> 
> Michael

I disagree with you here Michael. I regard signatures like  bumper
stickers. I wouldn't expect anyone to take a sticker off their car to
come to a meeting, and I don't expect anyone to change their sigfile
just to  post to our list. If you disagree with one that you see write
your own in reply. Or just ignore it. Personally I find the commercial
advertisements that some mail services affix more objectionable than
anyone's considered opinion. But it's really not worth taking issue with.

Too much issue has been take as it is.

Raymond McLaughlin





From peter at petertheplumber.net  Fri May 29 11:30:11 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 15:30:11 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3D7@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3D7@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <20090529153011.345c647b@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Fri, 29 May 2009 10:42:24 -0400
"Ingles, Raymond" <Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com> wrote:

> > From: Robert Jim Fulner
> 
> > In the future I assure you that I will attempt to remember to delete
> my
> > siganture from posts to MDLUG. (Almost forgot to do so just in this
> one).
> 
>  No need. I've never worried about it and I've got some fairly pointed
> ones.
>

	But allways entertaining! In fact I forward them from time to
	time, like this one.
 
>  Sincerely,
> 
>  Ray Ingles                                   (313) 227-2317
> 
>   "No federal income tax was assessed before 1913, because
>   government didn't require the kind of dough it needs now
>          that it's running a concierge business."
>  - Bill Maher, "When You Ride Alone You Ride With bin Laden"
Best Regards,
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm
Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From mdbader at flash.net  Sat May 30 09:01:17 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 09:01:17 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>
	<4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <4A212E1D.2020007@flash.net>

In mine, I allow one or two text lines, no graphics, no links, no 
politics or religion.

Mike Bader

On 5/29/2009 6:37 PM, Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> Michael Corral wrote:
>    
>> 2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
>>      
>>> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>>        
>>>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>>>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>>>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>>>>          
>>> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>>>
>>> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
>>> care what you have in your signature file.
>>>        
>> Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
>> for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
>> Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
>> should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
>> a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.
>>
>> For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
>> on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
>> but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
>> his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).
>>
>> Michael
>>      
>
> I disagree with you here Michael. I regard signatures like  bumper
> stickers. I wouldn't expect anyone to take a sticker off their car to
> come to a meeting, and I don't expect anyone to change their sigfile
> just to  post to our list. If you disagree with one that you see write
> your own in reply. Or just ignore it. Personally I find the commercial
> advertisements that some mail services affix more objectionable than
> anyone's considered opinion. But it's really not worth taking issue with.
>
> Too much issue has been take as it is.
>
> Raymond McLaughlin
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>    


From gib at juno.com  Sat May 30 19:53:11 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 23:53:11 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  BACK ON TOPIC OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
Message-ID: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>


How about if we put this back into a technical discussion.  

1. Are there mail clients that will allow you to send signature files that are customized to the recipients rules?

2. Is there mail services that will enforce signature rules?

3. Are there generally accepted rules that can be considered?

---------- Original Message ----------
From: mike bader <mdbader at flash.net>
To: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Subject: Re: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 09:01:17 -0400

In mine, I allow one or two text lines, no graphics, no links, no 
politics or religion.

Mike Bader

On 5/29/2009 6:37 PM, Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> Michael Corral wrote:
>    
>> 2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
>>      
>>> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>>        
>>>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>>>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>>>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>>>>          
>>> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>>>
>>> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
>>> care what you have in your signature file.
>>>        
>> Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
>> for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
>> Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
>> should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
>> a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.
>>
>> For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
>> on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
>> but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
>> his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).
>>
>> Michael
>>      
>
> I disagree with you here Michael. I regard signatures like  bumper
> stickers. I wouldn't expect anyone to take a sticker off their car to
> come to a meeting, and I don't expect anyone to change their sigfile
> just to  post to our list. If you disagree with one that you see write
> your own in reply. Or just ignore it. Personally I find the commercial
> advertisements that some mail services affix more objectionable than
> anyone's considered opinion. But it's really not worth taking issue with.
>
> Too much issue has been take as it is.
>
> Raymond McLaughlin
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>    
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


____________________________________________________________
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From mdbader at flash.net  Sat May 30 22:17:37 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 22:17:37 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] BACK ON TOPIC OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>
References: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>
Message-ID: <4A21E8C1.4040307@flash.net>

There are thunderbird add-ons to select different signatures,

mike bader

On 5/30/2009 7:53 PM, gib at juno.com wrote:
> How about if we put this back into a technical discussion.
>
> 1. Are there mail clients that will allow you to send signature files that are customized to the recipients rules?
>
> 2. Is there mail services that will enforce signature rules?
>
> 3. Are there generally accepted rules that can be considered?
>
> ---------- Original Message ----------
> From: mike bader<mdbader at flash.net>
> To: MDLUG's Main discussion list<mdlug at mdlug.org>
> Subject: Re: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
> Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 09:01:17 -0400
>
> In mine, I allow one or two text lines, no graphics, no links, no
> politics or religion.
>
> Mike Bader
>
> On 5/29/2009 6:37 PM, Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
>    
>> Michael Corral wrote:
>>
>>      
>>> 2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
>>>
>>>        
>>>> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>>>
>>>>          
>>>>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>>>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>>>>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>>>>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>>>>>
>>>>>            
>>>> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>>>>
>>>> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
>>>> care what you have in your signature file.
>>>>
>>>>          
>>> Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
>>> for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
>>> Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
>>> should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
>>> a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.
>>>
>>> For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
>>> on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
>>> but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
>>> his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).
>>>
>>> Michael
>>>
>>>        
>> I disagree with you here Michael. I regard signatures like  bumper
>> stickers. I wouldn't expect anyone to take a sticker off their car to
>> come to a meeting, and I don't expect anyone to change their sigfile
>> just to  post to our list. If you disagree with one that you see write
>> your own in reply. Or just ignore it. Personally I find the commercial
>> advertisements that some mail services affix more objectionable than
>> anyone's considered opinion. But it's really not worth taking issue with.
>>
>> Too much issue has been take as it is.
>>
>> Raymond McLaughlin
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> mdlug mailing list
>> mdlug at mdlug.org
>> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>>
>>
>>      
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Compete with the big boys.  Click here to find products to benefit your business.
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsHcQaIaKNQw7sS5k6vSpNY8rQugNnGGxTEnKXbQF0BFr5ZPZg2vT6/
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>    


From billings at negate.org  Sat May 30 22:28:36 2009
From: billings at negate.org (Jonathan Billings)
Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 22:28:36 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] BACK ON TOPIC OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>
References: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>
Message-ID: <20090531022836.GC1024@netra.local>

On Sat, May 30, 2009 at 11:53:11PM +0000, gib at juno.com wrote:
> 1. Are there mail clients that will allow you to send signature
> files that are customized to the recipients rules? 

I can answer this question with one example:  Mutt.  You can set a
send-hook to be defined to use a different signature based on a
pattern.  Just set that pattern to include whatever recipient you want
to have sent a custom signature.

-- 
Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Sun May 31 05:30:20 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 05:30:20 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>
	<4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <4A224E2C.9020002@gmail.com>

Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> Michael Corral wrote:
>> 2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
>>> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>>>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>>>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>>> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>>>
>>> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
>>> care what you have in your signature file.
>> Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
>> for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
>> Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
>> should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
>> a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.
>>
>> For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
>> on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
>> but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
>> his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).
>>
>> Michael
> 
> I disagree with you here Michael. I regard signatures like  bumper
> stickers. I wouldn't expect anyone to take a sticker off their car to
> come to a meeting, and I don't expect anyone to change their sigfile
> just to  post to our list. If you disagree with one that you see write
> your own in reply. Or just ignore it. Personally I find the commercial
> advertisements that some mail services affix more objectionable than
> anyone's considered opinion. But it's really not worth taking issue with.
> 

However, the other Ray seems to take GREAT offense when someone
comments on his "bumper sticker" .sig files.

To me, if you don't want a reaction, then don't provoke one.

I prefer that MDLUG be non-political, yet when we get saturated
at times with political messages at the end of postings, then
to let that go constantly unanswered, if one disagrees, is to
make the appearance that all agree with it -- which is how
political correctness and silencing of minority opinions
start...with "groupthink"




> Too much issue has been take as it is.
> 
> Raymond McLaughlin


From driveray at ameritech.net  Sun May 31 05:48:33 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 05:48:33 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <4A224E2C.9020002@gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>	<4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>
	<4A224E2C.9020002@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A225271.6000102@ameritech.net>

Aaron Kulkis wrote:

> However, the other Ray seems to take GREAT offense when someone
> comments on his "bumper sticker" .sig files. 
> To me, if you don't want a reaction, then don't provoke one.
> I prefer that MDLUG be non-political, yet when we get saturated
> at times with political messages at the end of postings, then
> to let that go constantly unanswered,

As I indicated, the best was to answer a bumper sticker is with another
bumper sticker. The best way to answer a sigfile is with another sigfile.

These topics do not belong in the main body of discussion. Except, of
course on the discuss list.

Raymond McLaughlin


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Sun May 31 09:24:55 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 09:24:55 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com> (gib@juno.com)
References: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>
Message-ID: <20090531132455.41CA120AADA@starfox.local>

Gib,

> How about if we put this back into a technical discussion.

Thank you.

> 1. Are there mail clients that will allow you to send signature files
> that are customized to the recipients rules?

I doubt such exists, as such a mail client would need to parse
each signature and query each recipient.

Most clients support a means of setting a default signature and
selecting a signature when composing.

evolution and kmail:
  choose identity (from field:) and corresponding settings
    including default signature.
  choose signature from a configurable list

emacs:
  "mail-signature's value is ...
   Documentation:
   *Text inserted at end of mail buffer when a message is initialized.
   If t, it means to insert the contents of the file `mail-signature-file'.
   If a string, that string is inserted. ...
   Otherwise, it should be an expression; ..."

> 2. Is there mail services that will enforce signature rules?

Many mail services append signatures as a means of gaining advertising
revenue.  Many years ago, most mail services tried to enforce signature
rules (usually limiting length), but this only pushed spammers to
pollute content.  The resulting arms race was a
battle lost early in the history of spam.  Today, spam filters evolved
to allow more leeway after a signature marker ("e.g. --") thus
encouraging spammers not stopped to at least favor the signature.

See Emily PostNews (http://www.faqs.org/faqs/usenet/emily-postnews/part1/)
for further netiquette.



Most mail clients allow you to filter mail (e.g. direct it to a
junk/spam/trash directory) based on configurable rules.

procmailrc(5):
  ...
  :0:
  * ^from:.*spammer\@spam.com.*
  spam.raw
  ...

kmail:
  [Message/Create filter] ...



Some mail services only handle encrypted mail, which forces a minimum
effort for each message-recipient pairing, and so favors legitimate
mail (usually sent to fewer recipients) over spam (usually seeking
minimal cost per recipient).  IMHO, the objections to encrypted mail
and attack of supporting systems, has usually been by spammers.

Hopefully helpful,
-- 
Bob


  "If you can buy chicken nuggets in packs of 6, 9, or 20,
   what is the largest number you cannot buy?
   (rot13) sbegl-guerr"
      -- unknown



From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Sun May 31 10:09:25 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 10:09:25 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905282330i132e2761mfda81ab78c3edf80@mail.gmail.com>
	(message from Robert Jim Fulner on Fri, 29 May 2009 02:30:13 -0400)
References: <c768576f0905282330i132e2761mfda81ab78c3edf80@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090531140925.1645220AAED@starfox.local>

Jim,

> I'm still not sure what [I'm] doing wrong. I've spent the last couple hours
> working on this again. Installed evolution-mapi via apt-get
> Didn't notice any [different] options[.]  [According] to
> http://ww.go-evolution.org/MAPI_FAQ I should have a MAPI plugin available to
> enable under EDIT -> plugins to activate[.]
> Granted I spent quite a bit of time trying to [identify] my exchange server
> per those instructions as well as an idap browser is a new idea in and of
> itself to me...

Under CentOS-5 evolution, the plugin does not appear under new plugins,
from which I infer that it has no required configurable options.

(N.B. I don't have evolution handy, so the following menu locations are
untested.)
A new menu choice, MAPI, appeared under [Edit/Settings/Accounts/Add...]
for Server Type: .  I was able to select MAPI instead of Exchange
and upon doing so, dialog labels changed.  In particular, [Authenticate]
made debugging the identification of MAPI server much easier.

Hopefully helpful,
-- 
Bob

  "The gulls who scorn perfection for the sake of travel,
      go nowehere slowly.
   The gulls who scorn travel for the sake of perfection,
      go anywhere instantly."
	-- Chang, Jonathan Livingston Seagull by Richard Bach


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Sun May 31 12:12:17 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 12:12:17 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <20090531155000.89EE620AADA@starfox.local> (message from Robert
	Meier on Sun, 31 May 2009 11:50:00 -0400 (EDT))
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>
	<4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net> <4A224E2C.9020002@gmail.com>
	<20090531155000.89EE620AADA@starfox.local>
Message-ID: <20090531161217.E0BF020AAEC@starfox.local>

Aaron et al,

[Reply-to set to mdlug-discuss at mdlug.org]

Please move this non-linux discussion to mdlug-discuss

TIA,
-- 
Bob

    "An armed society is a polite society.
     Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
       -- Robert Heinlein

  "Science is the great antidote to the poison of enthusiasm and superstition."
     -- Adam Smith

  "Nothing has such power to broaden the mind,
   as the ability to investigate systematically and truly,
   all that comes under thy observation in life."
     -- Marcus Aurelius

  "Never trust a computer you can't throw out a window."
     -- Steve Wozniak

  "Computer science is no more about computers,
   than astronomy is about telescopes."
     -- Edsger Dijkstra



From rjclay at gmail.com  Sun May 31 22:04:27 2009
From: rjclay at gmail.com (Robert J. Clay)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 22:04:27 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <59050.10.1.1.111.1243476389.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
References: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<59050.10.1.1.111.1243476389.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
Message-ID: <a379574a0905311904s61ec7d2ai5e46f9fa6a6ed33a@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 10:06 PM, Dan DeSloover <dand at zifferent.net> wrote:
> I won't go cable because they are such enormous douchebags about blocking
> ports, running home servers and using routers and switches behind their
> equipment.

    Rather depends on which cable service you have available;  I
haven't been seeing those kind of issues...   (Road Runner via Bright
House networks...)



-- 
Robert J. Clay
rjclay at gmail.com


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Tue May  5 14:06:04 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Tue, 05 May 2009 14:06:04 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] [Fwd: Re:  windows linux network and printer]
Message-ID: <4A00800C.2020706@gmail.com>

This bounced the first time

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [mdlug] windows linux network and printer
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2009 11:27:46 -0400
From: Aaron Kulkis <akulkis00 at gmail.com>
To: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
References: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0904300923500.13086-100000 at home.nuge.com>

Jay Nugent wrote:
> Greetings,
> 
> On Thu, 30 Apr 2009, Aaron Kulkis wrote:
> 
>> Ken Spress wrote:
>>
>>> CUPS printer configuration and management is handled by the Printer Admin
>>> utility launched from the Gnome menu - System -> Administration -> Printing.
>> Or, more generally from a web browser with:
>> http://localhost:631/
>>
>> or from another machine:
>> http://host.name.here:631/
> 
>    So what do you do to configure CUPS via a browser from workstation on 
> the same LAN when the server you point the browser to only returns a 
> "403 Forbidden" message?  :(
> 
>    I have cups on a headless server (CentOS) that has NO GUI.  It's a
> "server" afterall...  So from my workstation, when pointing my browser to
> http://server1.nuge.com:631 all I ever get is a 403 Forbidden.

Strange.

1.
workstation:> ssh server1.nuge.com
Password:
nuge:> lynx localhost:631



2. It might be here in this section of  /etc/cups/cupsd.conf:


########
######## Browsing Options
########

#
# Browsing: whether or not to broadcast and/or listen for CUPS printer
# information on the network.  Enabled by default.
#

#Browsing On

#
# BrowseProtocols: which protocols to use for browsing.  Can be
# any of the following separated by whitespace and/or commas:
#
#     all  - Use all supported protocols.
#     cups - Use the CUPS browse protocol.
#     slp  - Use the SLPv2 protocol.
#
# The default is "cups".
#
# NOTE: If you choose to use SLPv2, it is *strongly* recommended that
#       you have at least one SLP Directory Agent (DA) on your
#       network.  Otherwise, browse updates can take several seconds,
#       during which the scheduler will not respond to client
#       requests.
#

#BrowseProtocols cups

#
# BrowseAddress: specifies a broadcast address to be used.  By
# default browsing information is not sent!
#
# Note: HP-UX does not properly handle broadcast unless you have a
# Class A, B, C, or D netmask (i.e. no CIDR support).
#
# Note: Using the "global" broadcast address (255.255.255.255) will
# activate a Linux demand-dial link with the default configuration.
# If you have a LAN as well as the dial-up link, use the LAN's
# broadcast address.
#
# The @LOCAL address broadcasts to all non point-to-point interfaces.
# For example, if you have a LAN and a dial-up link, @LOCAL would
# send printer updates to the LAN but not to the dial-up link.
# Similarly, the @IF(name) address sends to the named network
# interface, e.g. @IF(eth0) under Linux.  Interfaces are refreshed
# automatically (no more than once every 60 seconds), so they can
# be used on dynamically-configured interfaces, e.g. PPP, 802.11, etc.
#

#BrowseAddress x.y.z.255
#BrowseAddress x.y.255.255
#BrowseAddress x.255.255.255
#BrowseAddress 255.255.255.255
#BrowseAddress @LOCAL
#BrowseAddress @IF(name)

#
# BrowseShortNames: whether or not to use "short" names for remote printers
# when possible (e.g. "printer" instead of "printer at host".)  Enabled by
# default.
#

#BrowseShortNames Yes

#
# BrowseAllow: specifies an address mask to allow for incoming browser
# packets. The default is to allow packets from all addresses.
#
# BrowseDeny: specifies an address mask to deny for incoming browser
# packets. The default is to deny packets from no addresses.
#
# Both "BrowseAllow" and "BrowseDeny" accept the following notations for
# addresses:
#
#     All
#     None
#     *.domain.com
#     .domain.com
#     host.domain.com
#     nnn.*
#     nnn.nnn.*
#     nnn.nnn.nnn.*
#     nnn.nnn.nnn.nnn
#     nnn.nnn.nnn.nnn/mm
#     nnn.nnn.nnn.nnn/mmm.mmm.mmm.mmm
#     @LOCAL
#     @IF(name)
#
# The hostname/domainname restrictions only work if you have turned hostname
# lookups on!
#

#BrowseAllow address
#BrowseDeny address

BrowseAllow @LOCAL
BrowseDeny All

#
# BrowseInterval: the time between browsing updates in seconds.  Default
# is 30 seconds.
#
# Note that browsing information is sent whenever a printer's state changes
# as well, so this represents the maximum time between updates.
#
# Set this to 0 to disable outgoing broadcasts so your local printers are
# not advertised but you can still see printers on other hosts.
#

#BrowseInterval 30

#
# BrowseOrder: specifies the order of BrowseAllow/BrowseDeny comparisons.
#

#BrowseOrder allow,deny
#BrowseOrder deny,allow

#
# BrowsePoll: poll the named server(s) for printers
#

#BrowsePoll address:port

#
# BrowsePort: the port used for UDP broadcasts.  By default this is
# the IPP port; if you change this you need to do it on all servers.
# Only one BrowsePort is recognized.
#

#BrowsePort 631

#
# BrowseRelay: relay browser packets from one address/network to another.
#

#BrowseRelay source-address destination-address
#BrowseRelay @IF(src) @IF(dst)

#
# BrowseTimeout: the timeout for network printers - if we don't
# get an update within this time the printer will be removed
# from the printer list.  This number definitely should not be
# less the BrowseInterval value for obvious reasons.  Defaults
# to 300 seconds.
#

#BrowseTimeout 300




> 
>    What needs to be added or edited in /etc/cups/cupsd.conf to get this
> beast to at least let me *begin* to start configuring it????
> 

did you try using  using lynx?

> 
>    The only lines I have edited in cupsd.conf so far are:
> 
>       ####LogLevel info
>       LogLevel debug2        <------- more verbose error logs
>  
> 
>       Listen localhost:631
>       ## jjn 090429 -- Added following line
>       Listen 216.144.208.28:631  <-- web access went from not responding 
>                                      at all to now giving a 403 Forbidden 
>                                      message
> 
> 
>    Thanks!
>       --- Jay
>              
> Train how you will Operate, and you will Operate how you were Trained.
> +------------------------------------------------------------------------+
> | Jay Nugent   jjn at nuge.com    (734)484-5105    (734)649-0850/Cell       |
> |   Nugent Telecommunications  [www.nuge.com]                            |
> |   Internet Consulting/Linux SysAdmin/Engineering & Design/ISP Reseller |
> | ISP Monitoring [www.ispmonitor.org] ISP & Modem Performance Monitoring |
> | Web-Pegasus    [www.webpegasus.com] Web Hosting/DNS Hosting/Shell Accts|
> +------------------------------------------------------------------------+
>   9:01am  up 22 days,  8:14,  4 users,  load average: 0.12, 0.06, 0.01
> 
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug



From fulner at gmail.com  Tue May  5 17:49:49 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Tue, 5 May 2009 17:49:49 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
Message-ID: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>

OK,

So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.

At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should? Obviously
I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.

Yours in Liberty,
Jim


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Wed May  6 10:58:04 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 10:58:04 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Digital camcorders & Linux
Message-ID: <32976490.1241621885204.JavaMail.root@elwamui-muscovy.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Hello,

I am looking for a digital camcorder and I was wondering if anyone had any experience (good or bad) while using a camcorder with a linux box. Basically, I may want to download from the camcorder to the Linux box an burning the video to a DVD (using Myth?) etc. I am not planning to do any fancy video editing. Any issues with proprietary format etc that I should be aware of?

Thanks for any help


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Wed May  6 10:24:36 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 10:24:36 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with this?
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

It looks like the latest Ubuntu has built-in support for the key PS3
updates I want. (WPA support over wifi, and ps3-vram swap support.) So,
I figure I'll be pulling the trigger soon and stick Linux on my PS3.

 The only thing holding me back for now is the availability of a
big-enough backup drive, but it looks like I can borrow one for long
enough. I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
project - a Forth interpreter
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) ) running on
the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).

 Does anyone have any experience with this? Any gotchas I should look
out for?

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                              (313) 227-2317

 "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers.
  You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions." 
               -  Naguib Mahfouz
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From driveray at ameritech.net  Thu May  7 02:20:23 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 02:20:23 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A027DA7.5070808@ameritech.net>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> OK,
> 
> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
> 
> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should? Obviously
> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.
> 
> Yours in Liberty,
> Jim


I seriously doubt it make any difference. But that's just me.



From ldaphelp at thuemmel.com  Thu May  7 06:16:34 2009
From: ldaphelp at thuemmel.com (Mark Thuemmel)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 06:16:34 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Digital camcorders & Linux
In-Reply-To: <32976490.1241621885204.JavaMail.root@elwamui-muscovy.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <32976490.1241621885204.JavaMail.root@elwamui-muscovy.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4A02B502.9080904@thuemmel.com>

R. Kannan wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I am looking for a digital camcorder and I was wondering if anyone had any experience (good or bad) while using a camcorder with a linux box. Basically, I may want to download from the camcorder to the Linux box an burning the video to a DVD (using Myth?) etc. I am not planning to do any fancy video editing. Any issues with proprietary format etc that I should be aware of?
> 
> Thanks for any help

I bought a used Sony Camcorder with an i.LINK port for $100 on
Craigslist.  Added a $15 firewire card to my pc and cable.

This IEEE 1394 interface is also known by the brand names of FireWire
(Apple Inc.), i.LINK (Sony), and Lynx (Texas Instruments)

I do a "sudo chmod 777 /dev/raw1394" after plugging it in to talk to it
on my Ubuntu box, but after that Kino works well for capturing the video
off the camera and basic editing and then saving to mpeg.

Takes a lot of disk space.  Transcoding isn't too bad on my dual core cpu.

My kids make homemade videos and post them up to YouTube with it.


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Thu May  7 09:19:04 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 09:19:04 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [mdlug] Digital camcorders & Linux
Message-ID: <24535178.1241702344869.JavaMail.root@mswamui-valley.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Can any of the open source application read/transcode AVCHD format?

Thanks

-----Original Message-----
>From: Mark Thuemmel <ldaphelp at thuemmel.com>
>Sent: May 7, 2009 6:16 AM
>To: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
>Subject: Re: [mdlug] Digital camcorders & Linux
>
>R. Kannan wrote:
>> Hello,
>> 
>> I am looking for a digital camcorder and I was wondering if anyone had any experience (good or bad) while using a camcorder with a linux box. Basically, I may want to download from the camcorder to the Linux box an burning the video to a DVD (using Myth?) etc. I am not planning to do any fancy video editing. Any issues with proprietary format etc that I should be aware of?
>> 
>> Thanks for any help
>
>I bought a used Sony Camcorder with an i.LINK port for $100 on
>Craigslist.  Added a $15 firewire card to my pc and cable.
>
>This IEEE 1394 interface is also known by the brand names of FireWire
>(Apple Inc.), i.LINK (Sony), and Lynx (Texas Instruments)
>
>I do a "sudo chmod 777 /dev/raw1394" after plugging it in to talk to it
>on my Ubuntu box, but after that Kino works well for capturing the video
>off the camera and basic editing and then saving to mpeg.
>
>Takes a lot of disk space.  Transcoding isn't too bad on my dual core cpu.
>
>My kids make homemade videos and post them up to YouTube with it.


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From dcweyh at gmail.com  Thu May  7 09:40:59 2009
From: dcweyh at gmail.com (Darwin Weyh)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 09:40:59 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <cdb5824d0905070640o6bffec7ama39e675ba53abbed@mail.gmail.com>

I send them off but I doubt they will do anything but it will help to fill
the database with Open Source Programs so maybe some Data Analysist will put
it in a report someday.

Darwin Weyh
Underemployed Computer Consultant
Email: dcweyh at gmail.com
Site: www.weyh.net
Current Project: www.skillzdesk.com


On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Robert Jim Fulner <fulner at gmail.com> wrote:

> OK,
>
> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
>
> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should?
> Obviously
> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.
>
> Yours in Liberty,
> Jim
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>


From dcweyh at gmail.com  Thu May  7 09:36:55 2009
From: dcweyh at gmail.com (Darwin Weyh)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 09:36:55 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with this?
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <cdb5824d0905070636p5ff28db5l926b4a6af285dd06@mail.gmail.com>

Ahh FORTH.  I havn't heard much about that for 25 years.  I was once told
it's a programming language that used the programmer as the compiler.

Have fun with that.

Underemployed Computer Consultant
Email: dcweyh at gmail.com
Site: www.weyh.net
Current Project: www.skillzdesk.com


On Wed, May 6, 2009 at 10:24 AM, Ingles, Raymond <
Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com> wrote:

> It looks like the latest Ubuntu has built-in support for the key PS3
> updates I want. (WPA support over wifi, and ps3-vram swap support.) So,
> I figure I'll be pulling the trigger soon and stick Linux on my PS3.
>
>  The only thing holding me back for now is the availability of a
> big-enough backup drive, but it looks like I can borrow one for long
> enough. I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
> project - a Forth interpreter
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language)<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_%28programming_language%29>) running on
> the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).
>
>  Does anyone have any experience with this? Any gotchas I should look
> out for?
>
>  Sincerely,
>
>  Ray Ingles                              (313) 227-2317
>
>  "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers.
>  You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions."
>               -  Naguib Mahfouz
> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It
> contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named
> addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose
> it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately
> and then destroy it.
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>


From lugnuts at doehler.us  Thu May  7 09:58:02 2009
From: lugnuts at doehler.us (Joe Doehler)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 09:58:02 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with  this?
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.na
	sa.cpwr.corp>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <E1M246I-0003qQ-00@doehler.us>

At 10:24 AM 5/6/2009, Ray wrote:
 >I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
>project - a Forth interpreter
>(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) ) running on
>the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).

Thanks for the tip. I am downloading Yellowdog for PS3 as I write this.

The PS3 has some formidable performance potential:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cell_(microprocessor)

I doubt that all that potential can be used with Yellowdog. Some web 
sites state that Sony locks out access to the SPU's when alternate 
OS's are installed, in fear that they could be used for cracking 
their games, but some people appear to have broken that barrier:
http://www.physorg.com/news92674403.html

Joe.




From starline at wideopenwest.com  Thu May  7 10:09:20 2009
From: starline at wideopenwest.com (bob dion)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 10:09:20 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <cdb5824d0905070640o6bffec7ama39e675ba53abbed@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<cdb5824d0905070640o6bffec7ama39e675ba53abbed@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A02EB90.3020604@wideopenwest.com>

Why give MS anymore ammo, than it already has, to screw with competitive 
products.

BD

Darwin Weyh wrote:
> I send them off but I doubt they will do anything but it will help to fill
> the database with Open Source Programs so maybe some Data Analysist will put
> it in a report someday.
> 
> Darwin Weyh
> Underemployed Computer Consultant
> Email: dcweyh at gmail.com
> Site: www.weyh.net
> Current Project: www.skillzdesk.com
> 
> 
> On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Robert Jim Fulner <fulner at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> OK,
>>
>> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
>>
>> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
>> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
>> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should?
>> Obviously
>> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
>> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
>> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
>> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
>> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.
>>
>> Yours in Liberty,
>> Jim
>> _______________________________________________
>> mdlug mailing list
>> mdlug at mdlug.org
>> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
> 


From lugnuts at doehler.us  Thu May  7 10:13:50 2009
From: lugnuts at doehler.us (Joe Doehler)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 10:13:50 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with  this?
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.na
	sa.cpwr.corp>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <E1M24Kr-0003qb-00@doehler.us>

Here's more info on installing Linux on a PS3:

First, a dual-boot configuration must be created:
http://tinyurl.com/dxg56d

Likely, all the stuff you have stored on the PS3 will be gone.

Second, install a Linux distribution that uses all the SPU's:
http://www.ps3cluster.umassd.edu/step1setup.html

This installation also enables the optional creation of PS3 clusters 
- just in case you want your own supercomputer...

Joe.



From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Thu May  7 10:21:12 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 10:21:12 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with  this?
In-Reply-To: <E1M246I-0003qQ-00@doehler.us>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<E1M246I-0003qQ-00@doehler.us>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A8@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: Joe Doehler

> I doubt that all that potential can be used with Yellowdog. Some web
> sites state that Sony locks out access to the SPU's when alternate
> OS's are installed, in fear that they could be used for cracking
> their games, but some people appear to have broken that barrier:
> http://www.physorg.com/news92674403.html

 Not exactly. Linux runs under a hypervisor on the PS3; it gets access
to the main CPU core (basically a PowerPC core at 3.2GHZ) and six of the
seven SPU's. (The seventh is used by the hypervisor.) You don't get
direct access to the hard disk, either, but you have some choice about
how much space you get.

 What you *don't* get is access to the "RSX", the graphics processor, so
no hardware-accelerated 3D graphics. Graphics is basically a glorified
framebuffer. (Some people found a hole that got access to it for a
while, but that was closed in later versions of the PS3's firmware.)

 The RSX, though, has 256MB of memory. People have figured out how to
use that as a fast swap device, effectively doubling the amount of RAM
available to Linux. This makes Linux a lot more usable. Now that that
technique is in Ubuntu out-of-the-box, I figure it's time.

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                       (313) 227-2317

 "Useless laws weaken the necessary laws." - Charles Montesquieu
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Thu May  7 11:43:53 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 11:43:53 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A0301B9.605@gmail.com>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> OK,
> 
> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
> 
> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should? Obviously
> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.

Microsoft snoops enough as it is already.
[It was from *spying* on IE users and discovering that many were
visiting travel websites which prompted MS to create Expedia.com]


From GregWojtak at quickenloans.com  Thu May  7 12:21:08 2009
From: GregWojtak at quickenloans.com (Wojtak, Greg)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 12:21:08 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <4A0301B9.605@gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A0301B9.605@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9FB6372000B099469B46478B643EE4696048F843@EXCCRVS1.mi.corp.rockfin.com>

It's not "spying"... it's "usage tracking!"  Microsoft told us so!

-----Original Message-----
From: mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org [mailto:mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Kulkis
Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 11:44 AM
To: MDLUG's Main discussion list
Subject: Re: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> OK,
> 
> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
> 
> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should? Obviously
> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.

Microsoft snoops enough as it is already.
[It was from *spying* on IE users and discovering that many were
visiting travel websites which prompted MS to create Expedia.com]
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Thu May  7 12:39:22 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 12:39:22 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Digital camcorders & Linux
In-Reply-To: <24535178.1241702344869.JavaMail.root@mswamui-valley.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <24535178.1241702344869.JavaMail.root@mswamui-valley.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3AA@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: R. Kannan 
> Can any of the open source application read/transcode AVCHD format?

 I'm kinda curious about that too, since we'll be looking into replacing
our aging camcorder soon. This looks like a useful link on that score:

 
http://www.fsckin.com/2008/01/03/transcoding-mtsm2ts-avchd-video-files-w
ith-free-software/

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                (313) 227-2317

 "If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear."
       - Slogan of the NKVD (forerunner of the KGB)
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May  7 16:08:39 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 20:08:39 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <9FB6372000B099469B46478B643EE4696048F843@EXCCRVS1.mi.corp.rockfin.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A0301B9.605@gmail.com>
	<9FB6372000B099469B46478B643EE4696048F843@EXCCRVS1.mi.corp.rockfin.com>
Message-ID: <20090507200839.0e894284@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Thu, 7 May 2009 12:21:08 -0400
"Wojtak, Greg" <GregWojtak at quickenloans.com> wrote:

> It's not "spying"... it's "usage tracking!"  Microsoft told us so!
> 
	And it's for your own good!
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm
Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From brian at dangerbacon.com  Thu May  7 22:52:08 2009
From: brian at dangerbacon.com (Brian)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 22:52:08 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with this?
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <6f64e9540905071952j18077d44o24d12f8730b86e20@mail.gmail.com>

I'd recommend that the first thing you do is install nethack.  Even
without access to the ps3 accellerated graphics the game is
beuatifully rendered in HD.

On 5/6/09, Ingles, Raymond <Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com> wrote:
> It looks like the latest Ubuntu has built-in support for the key PS3
> updates I want. (WPA support over wifi, and ps3-vram swap support.) So,
> I figure I'll be pulling the trigger soon and stick Linux on my PS3.
>
>  The only thing holding me back for now is the availability of a
> big-enough backup drive, but it looks like I can borrow one for long
> enough. I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
> project - a Forth interpreter
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) ) running on
> the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).
>
>  Does anyone have any experience with this? Any gotchas I should look
> out for?
>
>  Sincerely,
>
>  Ray Ingles                              (313) 227-2317
>
>  "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers.
>   You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions."
>                -  Naguib Mahfouz
> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It
> contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named
> addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose
> it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately
> and then destroy it.
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>

-- 
Sent from my mobile device

Brian
"It's not stupid, it's advaaanced!" - Tallest Purple


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Fri May  8 04:42:52 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 04:42:52 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with this?
In-Reply-To: <6f64e9540905071952j18077d44o24d12f8730b86e20@mail.gmail.com>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<6f64e9540905071952j18077d44o24d12f8730b86e20@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A03F08C.5080207@gmail.com>

Brian wrote:
> I'd recommend that the first thing you do is install nethack.  Even
> without access to the ps3 accellerated graphics the game is
> beuatifully rendered in HD.
>

Nethack is an ascii-game.
 
> On 5/6/09, Ingles, Raymond <Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com> wrote:
>> It looks like the latest Ubuntu has built-in support for the key PS3
>> updates I want. (WPA support over wifi, and ps3-vram swap support.) So,
>> I figure I'll be pulling the trigger soon and stick Linux on my PS3.
>>
>>  The only thing holding me back for now is the availability of a
>> big-enough backup drive, but it looks like I can borrow one for long
>> enough. I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
>> project - a Forth interpreter
>> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) ) running on
>> the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).
>>
>>  Does anyone have any experience with this? Any gotchas I should look
>> out for?
>>
>>  Sincerely,
>>
>>  Ray Ingles                              (313) 227-2317
>>
>>  "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers.
>>   You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions."
>>                -  Naguib Mahfouz
>> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It
>> contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named
>> addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose
>> it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately
>> and then destroy it.


From brian at dangerbacon.com  Fri May  8 09:40:21 2009
From: brian at dangerbacon.com (Brian)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 09:40:21 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Linux on the PS3 - anyone have experience with this?
In-Reply-To: <4A03F08C.5080207@gmail.com>
References: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3A2@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<6f64e9540905071952j18077d44o24d12f8730b86e20@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A03F08C.5080207@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6f64e9540905080640g7b198a03h17a48aef99cc2fe@mail.gmail.com>

Yes, it is :)

On 5/8/09, Aaron Kulkis <akulkis00 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Brian wrote:
>> I'd recommend that the first thing you do is install nethack.  Even
>> without access to the ps3 accellerated graphics the game is
>> beuatifully rendered in HD.
>>
>
> Nethack is an ascii-game.
>
>> On 5/6/09, Ingles, Raymond <Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com> wrote:
>>> It looks like the latest Ubuntu has built-in support for the key PS3
>>> updates I want. (WPA support over wifi, and ps3-vram swap support.) So,
>>> I figure I'll be pulling the trigger soon and stick Linux on my PS3.
>>>
>>>  The only thing holding me back for now is the availability of a
>>> big-enough backup drive, but it looks like I can borrow one for long
>>> enough. I'd like to play with it, and I have a half-assed notion for a
>>> project - a Forth interpreter
>>> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_(programming_language) ) running on
>>> the SPUs (the little vector coprocessors on the PS3's CPU).
>>>
>>>  Does anyone have any experience with this? Any gotchas I should look
>>> out for?
>>>
>>>  Sincerely,
>>>
>>>  Ray Ingles                              (313) 227-2317
>>>
>>>  "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers.
>>>   You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions."
>>>                -  Naguib Mahfouz
>>> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It
>>> contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named
>>> addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or
>>> disclose
>>> it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us
>>> immediately
>>> and then destroy it.
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>

-- 
Sent from my mobile device

Brian
"It's not stupid, it's advaaanced!" - Tallest Purple


From danno at umich.edu  Fri May  8 15:00:53 2009
From: danno at umich.edu (Dan Pritts)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 15:00:53 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
In-Reply-To: <9FB6372000B099469B46478B643EE4696048F843@EXCCRVS1.mi.corp.rockfin.com>
References: <c768576f0905051449u5300f984pa723cdde73a70bbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A0301B9.605@gmail.com>
	<9FB6372000B099469B46478B643EE4696048F843@EXCCRVS1.mi.corp.rockfin.com>
Message-ID: <20090508190053.GA62882@maniac.deathstar.org>

FWIW, I know of at least one open-source project (openafs) that
gets, and uses, the feedback from the microsoft automatic crash
reporter.

On Thu, May 07, 2009 at 12:21:08PM -0400, Wojtak, Greg wrote:
> It's not "spying"... it's "usage tracking!"  Microsoft told us so!
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org [mailto:mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Kulkis
> Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 11:44 AM
> To: MDLUG's Main discussion list
> Subject: Re: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
> 
> Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> > OK,
> > 
> > So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
> > 
> > At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
> > Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
> > option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should? Obviously
> > I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
> > I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
> > about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
> > are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
> > opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.
> 
> Microsoft snoops enough as it is already.
> [It was from *spying* on IE users and discovering that many were
> visiting travel websites which prompted MS to create Expedia.com]
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

danno
--
dan pritts
danno at umich.edu
734-929-9770


From lnovak1 at ford.com  Fri May  8 16:58:13 2009
From: lnovak1 at ford.com (Novak, Louis (L.M.))
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 16:58:13 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] adding wireless to existing network
Message-ID: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF04B@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>


Hey Folks,

I'm trying to add a LINKSYS WRT54G2 to an existing office network and am
missing
something I hope is relatively simple.

The wired network is an ATT DSL serviced network using 192.168.0.x with
the DSL
gateway at 192.168.0.1

I'm throwing away the auto setup on the WRT54G2 and trying to create a
wireless 
192.168.1.x subnet(?)

I can get on the wireless network but nothing makes it to the wired
side. Can't ping
the DSL gateway.

Netmask on both is 255.255.255.0  Is that the issue?

Thanks in advance for any advice or suggestions.

-- 
Louis Novak  lnovak1 at ford.com   (313)248-6788 
Ford Motor Co., IT Learning & Organizational Development
Eco-Tip: Bottled water is a waste of money and resources. 
Drink tap water from a reusable container instead.



From peter at petertheplumber.net  Fri May  8 17:24:01 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 21:24:01 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] adding wireless to existing network
In-Reply-To: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF04B@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
References: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF04B@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
Message-ID: <20090508212401.029c5007@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Fri, 8 May 2009 16:58:13 -0400
"Novak, Louis (L.M.)" <lnovak1 at ford.com> wrote:

> 
> Hey Folks,
> 
> I'm trying to add a LINKSYS WRT54G2 to an existing office network and
> am missing
> something I hope is relatively simple.
> 
> The wired network is an ATT DSL serviced network using 192.168.0.x
> with the DSL
> gateway at 192.168.0.1
> 
> I'm throwing away the auto setup on the WRT54G2 and trying to create a
> wireless 
> 192.168.1.x subnet(?)
> 
> I can get on the wireless network but nothing makes it to the wired
> side. Can't ping
> the DSL gateway.
> 
> Netmask on both is 255.255.255.0  Is that the issue?
> 
> Thanks in advance for any advice or suggestions.
> 

Dear Louis,
	While this link is from dd-wrt, it might have some usefull
	information.
<http://dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/Wireless_Access_Point> It sounds like
you're doing what I did, the guys here told me to turn off DHCP and
mine worked. More links to different configurations here
<http://dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/Linking_Routers>

Best Regards,

-- 
Peter The Plumber sm

Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From jbroughton at twmi.rr.com  Fri May  8 20:52:22 2009
From: jbroughton at twmi.rr.com (Jim Broughton)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 20:52:22 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] adding wireless to existing network
In-Reply-To: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF04B@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
References: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF04B@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
Message-ID: <4A04D3C6.6040209@twmi.rr.com>

Novak, Louis (L.M.) wrote:
> Hey Folks,
>
> I'm trying to add a LINKSYS WRT54G2 to an existing office network and am
> missing
> something I hope is relatively simple.
>
> The wired network is an ATT DSL serviced network using 192.168.0.x with
> the DSL
> gateway at 192.168.0.1
>
> I'm throwing away the auto setup on the WRT54G2 and trying to create a
> wireless 
> 192.168.1.x subnet(?)
>
> I can get on the wireless network but nothing makes it to the wired
> side. Can't ping
> the DSL gateway.
>
> Netmask on both is 255.255.255.0  Is that the issue?
>
> Thanks in advance for any advice or suggestions.
>
>   
If you plug the wan port into your
network anything behind the WRT54G has to be in another sub-net.
 If you choose unwisely to use the wan port you will have to setup ROUTING
within the routers settings (ADVANCED ROUTING) . You have to choose to set
the device as a router and not a gateway. Then make the appropriate 
settings to
get it to work. Can't remember what I did for those it was a few years ago.

 I did this once then decided it was a pain. So  now I just use one of 
the 4 switch
ports to plug into my main router (192.168.0.1). Everything is on the 
192.168.0.X
network, including the wireless.
BTW I have a WRT54G version3 not a G2.

Jim


From gib at juno.com  Fri May  8 22:39:09 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Sat, 9 May 2009 02:39:09 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
Message-ID: <20090508.223909.27719.1@webmail07.vgs.untd.com>


Well, take a scientific approach. Devise a hypothesis that can be tested and try it.  I would suggest that my hypothesis is that when submitting a bug report that a confirmation number (or ticket number) should be provided to check that status later. 

---------- Original Message ----------
From: bob dion <starline at wideopenwest.com>
To: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Subject: Re: [mdlug] Open Source Bug Reporting Windows
Date: Thu, 07 May 2009 10:09:20 -0400

Why give MS anymore ammo, than it already has, to screw with competitive 
products.

BD

Darwin Weyh wrote:
> I send them off but I doubt they will do anything but it will help to fill
> the database with Open Source Programs so maybe some Data Analysist will put
> it in a report someday.
> 
> Darwin Weyh
> Underemployed Computer Consultant
> Email: dcweyh at gmail.com
> Site: www.weyh.net
> Current Project: www.skillzdesk.com
> 
> 
> On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Robert Jim Fulner <fulner at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> OK,
>>
>> So I wanted to run this by y'all and see what you think.
>>
>> At work I still run Windows, but most of the applications I use are Open
>> Source programs. If one of these applications crashes, Windoze offers me an
>> option to tell Microsoft about the problem. Do you think I should?
>> Obviously
>> I SHOULD file a bug report with the particular project team, and as soon as
>> I figure out how to do that I certainly will, but should I tell Microsoft
>> about it? My paranoid schizophrenic self says "don't tell the enemy what we
>> are working on", but before I make this decision I'd like to here the
>> opinions of a few more crazy penguin lovers.
>>
>> Yours in Liberty,
>> Jim
>> _______________________________________________
>> mdlug mailing list
>> mdlug at mdlug.org
>> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
> 
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


____________________________________________________________
Click to find information on your credit score and your credit report.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsHCkVTwcClU5LpdVzjQeZHLUwVkwCcZDF6OxQYlRWt8yIrEDvT7O4/


From gib at juno.com  Fri May  8 22:45:29 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Sat, 9 May 2009 02:45:29 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  adding wireless to existing network
Message-ID: <20090508.224529.27719.2@webmail07.vgs.untd.com>


Set the neighbor gateway.

Your using that at Ford?

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Novak, Louis (L.M.)" <lnovak1 at ford.com>
To: "MDLUG's Main discussion list" <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Subject: [mdlug] adding wireless to existing network
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 16:58:13 -0400



Hey Folks,

I'm trying to add a LINKSYS WRT54G2 to an existing office network and am
missing
something I hope is relatively simple.

The wired network is an ATT DSL serviced network using 192.168.0.x with
the DSL
gateway at 192.168.0.1

I'm throwing away the auto setup on the WRT54G2 and trying to create a
wireless 
192.168.1.x subnet(?)

I can get on the wireless network but nothing makes it to the wired
side. Can't ping
the DSL gateway.

Netmask on both is 255.255.255.0  Is that the issue?

Thanks in advance for any advice or suggestions.

-- 
Louis Novak  lnovak1 at ford.com   (313)248-6788 
Ford Motor Co., IT Learning & Organizational Development
Eco-Tip: Bottled water is a waste of money and resources. 
Drink tap water from a reusable container instead.

_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


____________________________________________________________
Simple and Easy. Click here to wipe out your debt in 12-36 months.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsDjqHrlEUilzcG7tjz0tgFbBLk83txBd4mb7fUOL8dFKnfiD0JOyU/


From driveray at ameritech.net  Sun May 10 14:22:33 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 14:22:33 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] SEMCO Linux SIG
Message-ID: <4A071B69.5040502@ameritech.net>

MDLUGers:

As some of you may already know SEMCO <http://www.semco.org/>
(the South East Michigan Computer Group) is forming a Linux SIG (Special
Interest Group).

The organizers have settled on the fourth Tuesdays of each month for
their meeting, in the meeting room of the Oak Park Public Library
<http://www.oakpark-mi.com/library/index.asp>


14200 Oak Park Boulevard, Oak Park, MI 48237
<http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=14200+Oak+Park+Blvd,+Oak+Park,+MI+48237&sll=42.46575,-83.19279&sspn=0.012236,0.035877&gl=us&ie=UTF8&z=16>

MDLUG is providing this SIG with a mailing list for meeting
announcements and organizational discussion
<http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/sig-linux/>

We all hope to see you there.

Raymond McLaughlin
President MDLUG


From mdbader at flash.net  Mon May 11 21:30:18 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Mon, 11 May 2009 21:30:18 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] SEMCO Linux SIG
In-Reply-To: <4A071B69.5040502@ameritech.net>
References: <4A071B69.5040502@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <4A08D12A.6090608@flash.net>

Thanks Ray,

Time is 6:45-8:45 pm
There is wireless Internet.

mike bader

On 5/10/2009 2:22 PM, Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> MDLUGers:
>
> As some of you may already know SEMCO<http://www.semco.org/>
> (the South East Michigan Computer Group) is forming a Linux SIG (Special
> Interest Group).
>
> The organizers have settled on the fourth Tuesdays of each month for
> their meeting, in the meeting room of the Oak Park Public Library
> <http://www.oakpark-mi.com/library/index.asp>
>
>
> 14200 Oak Park Boulevard, Oak Park, MI 48237
> <http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=14200+Oak+Park+Blvd,+Oak+Park,+MI+48237&sll=42.46575,-83.19279&sspn=0.012236,0.035877&gl=us&ie=UTF8&z=16>
>
> MDLUG is providing this SIG with a mailing list for meeting
> announcements and organizational discussion
> <http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/sig-linux/>
>
> We all hope to see you there.
>
> Raymond McLaughlin
> President MDLUG
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>    


From mdlug at wowway.com  Tue May 12 11:13:21 2009
From: mdlug at wowway.com (Dean Durant)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 11:13:21 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Medusa4 Cad?
Message-ID: <2134265949.5660881242141201510.JavaMail.root@md03.wow.synacor.com>

Has anyone used this? 

Ever since Dassault announced Catia would not be on unix, and pro-e pulled the plug on it's linux support, I've thought, there's a niche there. 

http://www.cad-schroer.com/index.php?ziel=Products-MEDUSA-M4Personal&ref=pr0903_m4p 

Impressions? 

Thanks, Dean 


From jhansonxi at gmail.com  Tue May 12 11:56:17 2009
From: jhansonxi at gmail.com (Jeff Hanson)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 11:56:17 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Medusa4 Cad?
In-Reply-To: <2134265949.5660881242141201510.JavaMail.root@md03.wow.synacor.com>
References: <2134265949.5660881242141201510.JavaMail.root@md03.wow.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <b02c40e90905120856n2726cdaex5c3096c2ed934cb9@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, May 12, 2009 at 11:13 AM, Dean Durant <mdlug at wowway.com> wrote:
> Has anyone used this?
>
> Ever since Dassault announced Catia would not be on unix, and pro-e pulled the plug on it's linux support, I've thought, there's a niche there.
>
> http://www.cad-schroer.com/index.php?ziel=Products-MEDUSA-M4Personal&ref=pr0903_m4p
>
> Impressions?
>

Never heard of it before although I'm aware of the other two.  It
looks interesting.  MEDUSA4's tool trays reminds me of M$'s "patented"
ribbon interface.

Most of my mechanical work is basic 2D, usually simple enclosure
designs for electronic products which I normally use AutoSketch for.
I just made a remodeling plan for a friends basement using QCaD.  It's
features are somewhere between AutoSketch and AutoCAD LT.  It's
probably not enough for what you need.


From fulner at gmail.com  Tue May 12 12:20:17 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 12:20:17 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] mdlug Digest????
Message-ID: <c768576f0905120920l16761e8dtd38ef6cf68b8cb83@mail.gmail.com>

So, like many of you I subscribe to the Digest, one day of getting new
e-mails from you all ever couple of minutes helped me change that, I like
y'all, but not that much :-)

However, I'm yet to figure out how the Digest thing actually works. Most
Digests I get are once a day, but MDLUG certainly isn't, as sometimes I get
4 of them,  and its not once it gets to a X number of emails, as sometimes I
get them with just one message in it.

Out of curiosity *what's the deal?*

Jim


From driveray at ameritech.net  Tue May 12 13:35:16 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 13:35:16 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] mdlug Digest????
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905120920l16761e8dtd38ef6cf68b8cb83@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905120920l16761e8dtd38ef6cf68b8cb83@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A09B354.7030707@ameritech.net>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> So, like many of you I subscribe to the Digest, one day of getting new
> e-mails from you all ever couple of minutes helped me change that, I like
> y'all, but not that much :-)
> 
> However, I'm yet to figure out how the Digest thing actually works. Most
> Digests I get are once a day, but MDLUG certainly isn't, as sometimes I get
> 4 of them,  and its not once it gets to a X number of emails, as sometimes I
> get them with just one message in it.
> 
> Out of curiosity *what's the deal?*
> 
> Jim

You should be getting one every day. We have recently had problems with
the server being down for days at a time. When we get it back up you are
probably getting several days worth at once. Also the are sometimes
stretches of several days with not activity. the there would be (I
think) no digest either.

Sorry
Raymond McLaughlin
Server Admin MDLUG


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Wed May 13 00:33:58 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 00:33:58 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] dia problem exporting to
Message-ID: <20090513043358.C828B20AAEC@starfox.local>

diagrammers,

Has anyone had difficulties exporting diagrams from dia(1) to svg?

os: linux-2.4
distro: centos-release-5.2
exec: dia-0.96.1 (built June 2007)

UML state machine diagrams appear fine on the screen
and when exported to .png,
but when exported to .svg, the text is about 150% too large for
the boxes and sometimes overwritten.

The latest version (Dec 2008) requires loading and building
at least ~20 dependencies on CentOS-5.2.

Is there a repository likely to have more up to date dia?

Does anyone know whether or not the latest version corrects this problem?

TIA,
-- 
Bob

  "In all science, error precedes the truth,
   and it is better it should go first than last."
     -- Hugh Walpole



From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Wed May 13 18:19:13 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 18:19:13 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [mdlug] Camcorder does not mount
Message-ID: <3091636.1242253153920.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Hello,

I have a new Panasonic camcorder with USB connection. When I connect it to my laptop running Windows, it mounts as a file system that can be browsed. When I connect it to the same laptop running Linux (SuSE 10.1, Kernel 2.6), it does not mount automatically and the camcorder display says 'connecting'. 'lsusb' does not show any new device.

Anything I can try to debug?

Thanks

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From jhansonxi at gmail.com  Wed May 13 18:25:06 2009
From: jhansonxi at gmail.com (Jeff Hanson)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 18:25:06 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Camcorder does not mount
In-Reply-To: <3091636.1242253153920.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <3091636.1242253153920.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <b02c40e90905131525g7b119fcbu55e1d2a169796b68@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 6:19 PM, R. Kannan <rkannan at peoplepc.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I have a new Panasonic camcorder with USB connection. When I connect it to my laptop running Windows, it mounts as a file system that can be browsed. When I connect it to the same laptop running Linux (SuSE 10.1, Kernel 2.6), it does not mount automatically and the camcorder display says 'connecting'. 'lsusb' does not show any new device.
>
> Anything I can try to debug?
>

No idea.  Search for the model number and Linux or Suse to see if
anyone else had trouble.  Also check the kernel messages (dmesg) to
see if any activity is noted.


From driveray at ameritech.net  Wed May 13 18:21:30 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 18:21:30 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Camcorder does not mount
In-Reply-To: <3091636.1242253153920.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <3091636.1242253153920.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4A0B47EA.6000109@ameritech.net>

R. Kannan wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I have a new Panasonic camcorder with USB connection. When I connect it to
> my laptop running Windows, it mounts as a file system that can be browsed. When
> I connect it to the same laptop running Linux (SuSE 10.1, Kernel 2.6), it does
> not mount automatically and the camcorder display says 'connecting'. 'lsusb'
> does not show any new device.
> 
> Anything I can try to debug?
> 
> Thanks

The command dmesg|tail might tell you something, as might tail
/var/log/messages.

Beyond that the only thing I can suggest is to see if the memory media
is removable from the camcorder, and see if you can read it in a card
reader.


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Wed May 13 22:34:05 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 22:34:05 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [mdlug] Camcorder does not mount
Message-ID: <29530887.1242268445809.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Not sure what the problem was the last time I tried, but now it works fine. 

Thanks to all who replied.


-----Original Message-----
>From: Jeff Hanson <jhansonxi at gmail.com>
>Sent: May 13, 2009 6:25 PM
>To: "R. Kannan" <rkannan at peoplepc.com>, MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
>Subject: Re: [mdlug] Camcorder does not mount
>
>On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 6:19 PM, R. Kannan <rkannan at peoplepc.com> wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> I have a new Panasonic camcorder with USB connection. When I connect it to my laptop running Windows, it mounts as a file system that can be browsed. When I connect it to the same laptop running Linux (SuSE 10.1, Kernel 2.6), it does not mount automatically and the camcorder display says 'connecting'. 'lsusb' does not show any new device.
>>
>> Anything I can try to debug?
>>
>
>No idea.  Search for the model number and Linux or Suse to see if
>anyone else had trouble.  Also check the kernel messages (dmesg) to
>see if any activity is noted.


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From mdbader at flash.net  Tue May 19 15:55:32 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 15:55:32 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for Compaq
 Alpha and Debian
Message-ID: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>

thanks

Mike Bader


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Tue May 19 20:19:03 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 20:19:03 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net> (message from mike bader on Tue, 19
	May 2009 15:55:32 -0400)
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
Message-ID: <20090520001903.06E3220AAED@starfox.local>

Mike,

I've been happily using
+ Matrox PCI  card in Intel? 32-bit Dell box for 6yr?.
+ nVidia AGP  card in    AMD 64-bit HP   box for 2yr.
+ nVidia PCI? card in  Intel 32-bit      box for 15mo.

Reporting,
-- 
Bob

    "An armed society is a polite society.
     Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
       -- Robert Heinlein



From billings at negate.org  Tue May 19 21:01:08 2009
From: billings at negate.org (Jonathan Billings)
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 21:01:08 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s)
	for	Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <20090520001903.06E3220AAED@starfox.local>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
	<20090520001903.06E3220AAED@starfox.local>
Message-ID: <20090520010108.GF27667@meson.local>

On Tue, May 19, 2009 at 08:19:03PM -0400, Robert Meier wrote:
> Mike,
> 
> I've been happily using
> + Matrox PCI  card in Intel? 32-bit Dell box for 6yr?.
> + nVidia AGP  card in    AMD 64-bit HP   box for 2yr.
> + nVidia PCI? card in  Intel 32-bit      box for 15mo.

I think he's talking about an Alpha, as in DEC Alpha.  Not an x86
chip.  

I can't say I can offer any suggestions, other than to buy a video
card of the same vintage of the machine, and hope someone has already
figured out how to make it work.

-- 
Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>


From starline at wideopenwest.com  Wed May 20 07:12:03 2009
From: starline at wideopenwest.com (bob dion)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 07:12:03 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
Message-ID: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>

Hi Everyone,

A friend of mine is looking to purchase a netbook or laptop with 
built-in G3. Anyone have any experience carriers or coverage they'd like 
to pass along.?

Would buying an add-on card be better?

Any other comments?

Thanks
Bob


From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Wed May 20 08:09:08 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 08:09:08 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
	Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: mike bader


> Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
> Compaq Alpha and Debian

>From what I gather, most PCI cards *should* work, though 3D acceleration
almost certainly won't. 3D *definitely* won't work on Alpha for Nvidia
cards. I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
(http://www.alphalinux.org/docs/fbcon_faq.shtml) You can have it for
free, assuming I can find it. I'll check tonight.

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                            (313) 227-2317

 "They say evil happens when good men do nothing. Well, the Democrats
 prove it also happens when mediocre people do nothing." - Bill Maher
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From jcbender at bendorius.com  Wed May 20 09:56:46 2009
From: jcbender at bendorius.com (Joseph C. Bender)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 09:56:46 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>
References: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>
Message-ID: <4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>

bob dion wrote:
> Hi Everyone,
> 
> A friend of mine is looking to purchase a netbook or laptop with 
> built-in G3. Anyone have any experience carriers or coverage they'd like 
> to pass along.?
> 
	1.  You're effectively carrier-locked the minute you get a EVDO module. 
  Sprint and Verizon generally will not activate each other's devices on 
their networks as a "native" device.

	2.  For the GSM carriers, EDGE is *terrible* for any kind of data 
throughput and HSDPA coverage is still kinda spotty, no matter what AT&T 
will tell you, and T-Mobile is so far behind on their HSDPA deployment, 
it's not even funny.
	
> Would buying an add-on card be better?
> 
	Yes.  For a few reasons.

	1.  You didn't just buy a really expensive module that's a bear to tear 
out if it goes bad or change carriers.

	2.  The externals give you a couple of different things that make life 
nice:

		A.  They generally give you an external antenna jack, so if you need 
to use an external antenna, you can.  This has come in handy a couple of 
times.  The USB modules are also nicely remoteable from the laptop.  The 
Compass 597 that I've got comes with a 2" USB extender that's got 
stiffener wires built in.  The net result is that I can plug that into 
my USB jack and pan/tilt the modem widget to get the internal antenna in 
the most optimal position.  This beats trying to get the whole laptop 
positioned *just right* so the internal module's antenna can get the 
best signal.  I also carry a little rig I made up with a USB extension 
cable and a suction cup+hook so I can slap the module on a window or 
hang it up somewhere optimal if that spot doesn't happen to be near 
where I'm using my laptop.
		
		B.  They've often also got nifty bells and whistles, like built-in GPS 
that spits out standard NMEA sentences for use with mapping programs. 
With the Sierra wireless devices, there's a string you can pass to the 
module via modprobe that'll activate the port, and it shows up as a USB 
serial port in /dev.
		
	3.  Linux support.  I've run across at least one internal laptop module 
that really didn't want to play nicely with Linux, even though it should 
have.  If you find that the external modem doesn't work right, you can 
always exchange it in the time period provided.  I've had good luck with 
the Sierra Wireless devices over the last couple of years, though I 
haven't really done anything with their newest devices.  I like my 
Compass 597 on Sprint, it's been really solid, and the built-in GPS is 
really nice.  Developing a OpenBSD driver has been a royal pain for it, 
but it works decently in Linux.


	Carrier-wise, I prefer Sprint for mobile "3G" data.  Verizon is really 
nasty about their transfer caps, and they've dragged a couple of my 
clients through some rather trying experiences trying to get their data 
plans set up properly.  AT&T isn't even on my consideration list because 
of their HSDPA coverage being marginal and the customer service hells I 
and some of my clients have endured with them.  Neither is T-Mobile, who 
doesn't even consider wireless data any sort of priority.

Hope this helps.

-JCB


-- 
Joseph C. Bender
Chief Artifex
Bendorius Consulting, LLC
Network and Telecommunications Consulting
jcbender at bendorius dot com


From driveray at ameritech.net  Wed May 20 09:58:06 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 09:58:06 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <4A140C6E.40800@ameritech.net>

Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>> From: mike bader
> 
> 
>> Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
>> Compaq Alpha and Debian
> 
>>From what I gather, most PCI cards *should* work, though 3D acceleration
> almost certainly won't. 3D *definitely* won't work on Alpha for Nvidia
> cards. I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
> (http://www.alphalinux.org/docs/fbcon_faq.shtml) You can have it for
> free, assuming I can find it. I'll check tonight.
> 
>  Sincerely,
> 
>  Ray Ingles                                            (313) 227-2317

I have an old Voodoo card that might work. I have looked at Mikes
machine. I works OK in text mode but we haven't been able to get X
running. This is the latest Debian we're talking about here. The current
video card is an ATI of some sort, I think an early rage. Trying to
start X with any of the ati drivers resulted in a device not found error.

The output of lspci -vv named a frame buffer module for this device.
Loading this module (it was not loading on boot) and then starting X
with any of the ati drivers selected (in xorg.conf) still gave a device
not found error. Selecting framebuffer as the driver, without the module
loaded likewise gives such an error. (I writing this is all from
memory). Selecting framebuffer as the driver, with the module loaded
would light up the screen and lock the machine.

Mike might be persuaded to bring this machine in to the Linux SIG
meeting at the Oak Park Library next Tuesday evening. A topic has not
been yet determined.


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Wed May 20 11:25:46 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 11:25:46 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] MS patents OS crippling
Message-ID: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

In case you haven't seen this, MS has patented the tools for extortion:

"On Tuesday, Microsoft was granted US Patent No. 7,536,726 (it was filed in 2005) for intentionally crippling the functionality of an operating system by 'making selected portions and functionality of the operating system unavailable to the user or by limiting the user's ability to add software applications or device drivers to the computer' until an 'agreed upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make available the restricted functionality.' According to Microsoft, this solves a 'problem inherent in open architecture systems,' i.e., 'they are generally licensed with complete use rights and/or functionality that may be beyond the need or desire of the system purchaser.' An additional problem with open architecture systems, Microsoft explains, is that 'virtually anyone can write an application that can be executed on the system.' Nice to see the USPTO rewarding Microsoft's eight problem-solving inventors, including Linux killer (and antelope killer) Joachim Kempin, who's been credited with getting Microsoft hauled into federal court on antitrust charges."

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=7,536,726.PN.&OS=PN/7,536,726&RS=PN/7,536,726


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From driveray at ameritech.net  Wed May 20 11:44:03 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 11:44:03 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] MS patents OS crippling
In-Reply-To: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4A142543.7080903@ameritech.net>

R. Kannan wrote:
> In case you haven't seen this, MS has patented the tools for extortion:
> 
> "On Tuesday, Microsoft was granted US Patent No. 7,536,726 (it was filed in 2005) for intentionally crippling the functionality of an operating system by 'making selected portions and functionality of the operating system unavailable to the user or by limiting the user's ability to add software applications or device drivers to the computer' until an 'agreed upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make available the restricted functionality.' According to Microsoft, this solves a 'problem inherent in open architecture systems,' i.e., 'they are generally licensed with complete use rights and/or functionality that may be beyond the need or desire of the system purchaser.' An additional problem with open architecture systems, Microsoft explains, is that 'virtually anyone can write an application that can be executed on the system.' Nice to see the USPTO rewarding Microsoft's eight problem-solving inventors, including Linux killer (and antelope killer) Joachim Kempin
, 
>  who's been credited with getting Microsoft hauled into federal court on antitrust charges."
> 
> http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=7,536,726.PN.&OS=PN/7,536,726&RS=PN/7,536,726
> 

And, I think, prior art is trivial to find. A couple of weeks ago I got
some limited experience with DEC's TRU64 UNIX. My research lead me to
references indicating that system functionality depended on certain
license files (PAK files if I recall) being present and up to date.


From gib at juno.com  Tue May 19 07:55:25 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 11:55:25 GMT
Subject: [mdlug] i3 Detroit Meeting Every Tuesday
Message-ID: <20090519.075525.19352.0@webmail15.vgs.untd.com>

 
Just thought I'd send a note to let everyone know that i3detroit.com plans to have meetings every Tuesday.

Check the web site:
http://www.i3detroit.com/

---------- Forwarded Message ----------
From: i3 Detroit <contact at i3detroit.com>
To: Gib <gib at juno.com>
Subject: Re: i3 Detroit contact request
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 18:54:13 -0400

Gib,

Thanks for the thought. We will actual be discussing tonight moving  
the meeting to a new night based on other groups nights so that we can  
have people from other groups join us.

The meeting notes from tonights meeting will be posted on the site  
with meeting details. We hope to see you at our next meeting.

Thanks

Russ
Founder
Rwolfe at i3detroit.com


On May 12, 2009, at 6:34 PM, Gib <gib at juno.com> wrote:

>
> Gib wrote:
> Just a thought, don't schedule your meeting for the same night as  
> mug.org.
>
> Website: Meeting same night as mug.org
> IP: 66.51.146.158

____________________________________________________________
Best Weight Loss Program - Click Here!
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsEGrHXjglqNtXeEYT1TUHMDWgr6wodJARa9rqVBP39XAhtX3WHd1u/


From gib at juno.com  Tue May 19 16:02:08 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 20:02:08 GMT
Subject: [mdlug] Livonia Middle School Tech Expo - May 27
Message-ID: <20090519.160208.20265.1@webmail04.vgs.untd.com>

  
I saw a note about the Tech Expo that Livonia Public School is planning to do May 27Th. I asked if they want me to forward the information to the groups in the area. They do.

 
Subject: District Tech Expo - May 27


Hello Livonia Public Schools? Community,
Technology, Technology, Technology!!!  Everywhere we turn, every place we look and everything we do seems to be impacted by technology.   During the past year, students in LPS are doing some wonderful things with technology both inside and outside of school.  We would love to share some of these tools with LPS parents, staff and community members through an evening dedicated to exploring current and emerging technologies as LPS presents?
<?XML:NAMESPACE PREFIX = O />
Tech Expo 2009
?Communicating, Collaborating and Connecting?
Wednesday, May 27, 2009
6:00 to 8:30 p.m.
Holmes Middle School
 Sessions include..?         The NEW District Website?         Pinnacle (Parent Internet Viewer)?         Latest and Greatest in Technology (Skype, Twitter, etc)?         YouTube?         Social Networking?         Research Skills and Techniques using Technology?         Multimedia Tools?         And Much, Much More! The evening will end with a town hall style, panel discussion about the latest trends and issues in technology.  It truly will be an evening for you to ?catch-up? with what the younger generations are doing with technology.  Take advantage of this unique opportunity to learn about these tools FREE of charge!  More details are located on the district's new website at http://www.livoniapublicschools.org/files/calendar/techexpo.pdf

For more information, contact Carol Tinney at ctinney at livoniapublicschools.org

Hope to see you there!

Carol Tinney
Supervisor of Instructional Technology

____________________________________________________________
You have a right to seek justice!  Click here to find experienced lawyers across the USA.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsM918cpphbrx3iBaqz8MZjX0RqXn05UMNb8x0HJDwDGsvP4ybskgg/


From akoper at ameritech.net  Wed May 20 12:19:06 2009
From: akoper at ameritech.net (Andrew Koper)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 12:19:06 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Selling software
Message-ID: <006301c9d966$b3cfee50$1b6fcaf0$@net>

I need lots of large lists of contact information for companies - all
different industries and geographic areas.  Dun and Bradstreet has a
database of the companies that make up the U.S. economy, but they charge $$
for that info.  Where and how can I get that information online?

 

Are there people on this list that have experience selling software to
companies?  I would like to take you out to lunch and pick your brain for
advice on how to do that.

 

____________________

 

Andrew Koper

Founder & CEO

work-flow.biz

PO Box 32838

Detroit, MI 48232

p: 313-554-1060

e: akoper at work-flow.biz

 

 



From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Wed May 20 14:39:34 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 14:39:34 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] MS patents OS crippling
In-Reply-To: <4A142543.7080903@ameritech.net>
References: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<4A142543.7080903@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3C0@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: Raymond McLaughlin 
> R. Kannan wrote:
> > In case you haven't seen this, MS has patented the tools for
extortion:
> >
> > "On Tuesday, Microsoft was granted US Patent No. 7,536,726 (it was
filed
> in 2005) for intentionally crippling the functionality of an operating
> system by 'making selected portions and functionality of the operating
> system unavailable to the user or by limiting the user's ability to
add
> software applications or device drivers to the computer' until an
'agreed
> upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make available the
> restricted functionality.'
> 
> And, I think, prior art is trivial to find. A couple of weeks ago I
got
> some limited experience with DEC's TRU64 UNIX. My research lead me to
> references indicating that system functionality depended on certain
> license files (PAK files if I recall) being present and up to date.

 Lots of mainframes had similar restrictions, too.

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                                (313)
227-2317

  "...it is largely unnecessary to trade civil liberties for security...
   the best security measures -- reinforcing the airplane cockpit door,
   putting barricades and guards around important buildings, improving
  authentication for telephone and Internet banking -- have no effect on
     civil liberties. Broad surveillance is a mark of bad security."
                           - Bruce Schneier
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From starline at wideopenwest.com  Wed May 20 15:04:31 2009
From: starline at wideopenwest.com (bob dion)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 15:04:31 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
References: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>
	<4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
Message-ID: <4A14543F.8030905@wideopenwest.com>

Thank you Joseph for detailed reply. I will be passing this info along.

I was leaning towards suggesting an add on card and your explanation 
will add some weight.

I was also going to suggest a Linux box, we'll see what happens there.

Bob

Joseph C. Bender wrote:
> bob dion wrote:
>> Hi Everyone,
>>
>> A friend of mine is looking to purchase a netbook or laptop with 
>> built-in G3. Anyone have any experience carriers or coverage they'd like 
>> to pass along.?
>>
> 	1.  You're effectively carrier-locked the minute you get a EVDO module. 
>   Sprint and Verizon generally will not activate each other's devices on 
> their networks as a "native" device.
> 
> 	2.  For the GSM carriers, EDGE is *terrible* for any kind of data 
> throughput and HSDPA coverage is still kinda spotty, no matter what AT&T 
> will tell you, and T-Mobile is so far behind on their HSDPA deployment, 
> it's not even funny.
> 	
>> Would buying an add-on card be better?
>>
> 	Yes.  For a few reasons.
> 
> 	1.  You didn't just buy a really expensive module that's a bear to tear 
> out if it goes bad or change carriers.
> 
> 	2.  The externals give you a couple of different things that make life 
> nice:
> 
> 		A.  They generally give you an external antenna jack, so if you need 
> to use an external antenna, you can.  This has come in handy a couple of 
> times.  The USB modules are also nicely remoteable from the laptop.  The 
> Compass 597 that I've got comes with a 2" USB extender that's got 
> stiffener wires built in.  The net result is that I can plug that into 
> my USB jack and pan/tilt the modem widget to get the internal antenna in 
> the most optimal position.  This beats trying to get the whole laptop 
> positioned *just right* so the internal module's antenna can get the 
> best signal.  I also carry a little rig I made up with a USB extension 
> cable and a suction cup+hook so I can slap the module on a window or 
> hang it up somewhere optimal if that spot doesn't happen to be near 
> where I'm using my laptop.
> 		
> 		B.  They've often also got nifty bells and whistles, like built-in GPS 
> that spits out standard NMEA sentences for use with mapping programs. 
> With the Sierra wireless devices, there's a string you can pass to the 
> module via modprobe that'll activate the port, and it shows up as a USB 
> serial port in /dev.
> 		
> 	3.  Linux support.  I've run across at least one internal laptop module 
> that really didn't want to play nicely with Linux, even though it should 
> have.  If you find that the external modem doesn't work right, you can 
> always exchange it in the time period provided.  I've had good luck with 
> the Sierra Wireless devices over the last couple of years, though I 
> haven't really done anything with their newest devices.  I like my 
> Compass 597 on Sprint, it's been really solid, and the built-in GPS is 
> really nice.  Developing a OpenBSD driver has been a royal pain for it, 
> but it works decently in Linux.
> 
> 
> 	Carrier-wise, I prefer Sprint for mobile "3G" data.  Verizon is really 
> nasty about their transfer caps, and they've dragged a couple of my 
> clients through some rather trying experiences trying to get their data 
> plans set up properly.  AT&T isn't even on my consideration list because 
> of their HSDPA coverage being marginal and the customer service hells I 
> and some of my clients have endured with them.  Neither is T-Mobile, who 
> doesn't even consider wireless data any sort of priority.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> -JCB
> 
> 


From lnovak1 at ford.com  Wed May 20 15:10:12 2009
From: lnovak1 at ford.com (Novak, Louis (L.M.))
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 15:10:12 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
References: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>
	<4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
Message-ID: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF0A3@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>


Any thoughts on the MiFi(tm)2200 Intelligent Mobile Hotspot from
Verizon? 

Looks like a neat device and has gotten some nice reviews:

http://gizmodo.com/5256825/verizon-mifi-2200-3g-portable-wi+fi-hotspot-r
eview

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/07/technology/personaltech/07pogue.html?_
r=1&em

-- 
Louis Novak  lnovak1 at ford.com   (313)248-6788 
Ford Motor Co., IT Learning & Organizational Development
Eco-Tip: Bottled water is a waste of money and resources. 
Drink tap water from a reusable container instead. 



From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Wed May 20 16:08:01 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 16:08:01 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] MS patents OS crippling
In-Reply-To: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <4A146321.903@gmail.com>

R. Kannan wrote:
> In case you haven't seen this, MS has patented the tools for extortion:
> 
> "On Tuesday, Microsoft was granted US Patent No. 7,536,726 (it was filed in 2005) for intentionally crippling the functionality of an operating system by 'making selected portions and functionality of the operating system unavailable to the user or by limiting the user's ability to add software applications or device drivers to the computer' until an 'agreed upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make available the restricted functionality.' According to Microsoft, this solves a 'problem inherent in open architecture systems,' i.e., 'they are generally licensed with complete use rights and/or functionality that may be beyond the need or desire of the system purchaser.' An additional problem with open architecture systems, Microsoft explains, is that 'virtually anyone can write an application that can be executed on the system.' Nice to see the USPTO rewarding Microsoft's eight problem-solving inventors, including Linux killer (and antelope killer) Joachim Kempin
, 
>  who's been credited with getting Microsoft hauled into federal court on antitrust charges."
> 
> http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=7,536,726.PN.&OS=PN/7,536,726&RS=PN/7,536,726
> 

"until an 'agreed upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make available the restricted functionality.'"

In a closed source world, the technology to do this is trivial,
and therefore fails the obviousness test.

So it sounds more like a business methods patent to me -- all
of which were effectively rendered worthless at the appeals
court level last fall.  SCOTUS has allowed the counter-appeal
onto the docket -- I don't expect business methods to survive
their scrutiny, and software patents might get wiped out by
them, too, as both business methods and therefore algorithms
were allowed ONLY due to a peculiar ruling by a court back
in the 1990's, but in complete contradiction to both the
letter and the spirit of the Constitutional clause which
mandates that the federal government grant patents and
copyrights (the current duration of copyright ALSO violates
the clause which states "for limited periods of time" --
Life of Author + 20 years wasn't ever considered until
Mickey Mouse came in danger of falling into public domain,
and certainly not even during the early years of the country,
when life expectancy was below 50.

I doubt anyone will challenge this patent, though,
because it's worthless.  Even IBM stopped making
crippler-cards for their computers (the cards
would tie up the bus for a technician-selectable
percentage of the time) back in the 70's.  Getting
your mainframe upgraded (i.e. to higher throughput)
REALLY meant paying for an IBM technician to come
and pull the card OUT of the mainframe.


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Wed May 20 16:46:48 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 16:46:48 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Selling software
In-Reply-To: <006301c9d966$b3cfee50$1b6fcaf0$@net>
References: <006301c9d966$b3cfee50$1b6fcaf0$@net>
Message-ID: <4A146C38.7070601@gmail.com>

Andrew Koper wrote:
> I need lots of large lists of contact information for companies - all
> different industries and geographic areas.  Dun and Bradstreet has a
> database of the companies that make up the U.S. economy, but they charge $$
> for that info.  Where and how can I get that information online?
> 

One place to start is the stock exchanges:
NYSE (New York Stock Exchange), AMEX (American Exchange)
and NASDAQ (National Association of Securities Dealers Automated Quotations).

Every company traded on an exchange has to provide them
with a certain amount of information -- the names of the
officers, board of directors, and corporate headquarters.

All of this is in turn made publicly available.

I believe this hold true for both the national Over The
Counter exchange, and each of the 50's state's own state
level OTnformation -- the names of the
officers, board of directors, and corporate headquarters.

All of this is in turn made publicly available.

I believe this hold true for both the national Over The
Counter (OTC) exchange, and each of the 50's state's own
state level OTC.  For starters, contact the Michigan OTC.


From mdbader at flash.net  Thu May 21 08:01:19 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 08:01:19 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <4A140C6E.40800@ameritech.net>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<4A140C6E.40800@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <4A15428F.5020000@flash.net>



On 5/20/2009 9:58 AM, Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>    
>>> From: mike bader
>>>        
>>      
>>> Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
>>> Compaq Alpha and Debian
>>>        
>> > From what I gather, most PCI cards *should* work, though 3D acceleration
>> almost certainly won't. 3D *definitely* won't work on Alpha for Nvidia
>> cards. I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
>> (http://www.alphalinux.org/docs/fbcon_faq.shtml) You can have it for
>> free, assuming I can find it. I'll check tonight.
>>
>>   Sincerely,
>>
>>   Ray Ingles                                            (313) 227-2317
>>      
>
> I have an old Voodoo card that might work. I have looked at Mikes
> machine. I works OK in text mode but we haven't been able to get X
> running. This is the latest Debian we're talking about here. The current
> video card is an ATI of some sort, I think an early rage. Trying to
> start X with any of the ati drivers resulted in a device not found error.
>
> The output of lspci -vv named a frame buffer module for this device.
> Loading this module (it was not loading on boot) and then starting X
> with any of the ati drivers selected (in xorg.conf) still gave a device
> not found error. Selecting framebuffer as the driver, without the module
> loaded likewise gives such an error. (I writing this is all from
> memory). Selecting framebuffer as the driver, with the module loaded
> would light up the screen and lock the machine.
>
> Mike might be persuaded to bring this machine in to the Linux SIG
> meeting at the Oak Park Library next Tuesday evening. A topic has not
> been yet determined.
>
>    
I can bring it along. It isn't priority. We probably want to get 
organized and see how the groups wants to proceed.
I'm making a list of ideas, maybe an agenda of sorts, sign-in sheet. No 
hardwired Internet connection only wireless, unless we can rig something up.

Mike Bader


From mdbader at flash.net  Thu May 21 08:04:31 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 08:04:31 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>
	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>



On 5/20/2009 8:09 AM, Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>> From: mike bader
>>      
>
>
>    
>> Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
>> Compaq Alpha and Debian
>>      
>
> > From what I gather, most PCI cards *should* work, though 3D acceleration
> almost certainly won't. 3D *definitely* won't work on Alpha for Nvidia
> cards. I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
> (http://www.alphalinux.org/docs/fbcon_faq.shtml) You can have it for
> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.
>
> free, assuming I can find it. I'll check tonight.
>
>   Sincerely,
>
>   Ray Ingles                                            (313) 227-2317
>
>   "They say evil happens when good men do nothing. Well, the Democrats
>   prove it also happens when mediocre people do nothing." - Bill Maher
>
>    

thanks.
I have access to some cards, but it is hit and miss, and not certain 
that they work, and I may  have to go out and find drivers.

Mike Bader


From driveray at ameritech.net  Thu May 21 08:11:06 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 08:11:06 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net>	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>
Message-ID: <4A1544DA.3010107@ameritech.net>

mike bader wrote:
> 
> On 5/20/2009 8:09 AM, Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>>> From: mike bader
>>>      
>>
>>    
>>> Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
>>> Compaq Alpha and Debian
>>>      
>>> From what I gather, most PCI cards *should* work, though 3D acceleration
>> almost certainly won't. 3D *definitely* won't work on Alpha for Nvidia
>> cards. I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
>> (http://www.alphalinux.org/docs/fbcon_faq.shtml) You can have it for

>> free, assuming I can find it. I'll check tonight.
>>
>>   Sincerely,
>>
>>   Ray Ingles                                            (313) 227-2317
>>
>>   "They say evil happens when good men do nothing. Well, the Democrats
>>   prove it also happens when mediocre people do nothing." - Bill Maher
>>
>>    
> 
> thanks.
> I have access to some cards, but it is hit and miss, and not certain 
> that they work, and I may  have to go out and find drivers.
> 
> Mike Bader

Luckily the standard Debian install has a pretty good selection of video
drivers waiting to be loaded.



From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Thu May 21 08:32:50 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 08:32:50 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
	Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net><319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
	<4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3C6@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: mike bader

> On 5/20/2009 8:09 AM, Ingles, Raymond wrote:
> > I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
> thanks.
> I have access to some cards, but it is hit and miss, and not certain
> that they work, and I may  have to go out and find drivers.

 Okay, it's a PCI Matrox Millennium. Should be around 4MB VRAM. Matrox
cards were always well-supported in Linux, so I think you should be good
- that web page seems to indicate so. (I also have a 4MB PCI Riva 128,
but I don't think that'll work on an Alpha.) If you want either, they're
yours, just let me know.

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                     (313) 227-2317

 "Imagine a cluster of Windows machines. They'd have to have a
    team of MCSE's equipped with roller skates, just to keep
           pressing reset buttons." - Peter Jensen
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From jcbender at bendorius.com  Thu May 21 08:44:04 2009
From: jcbender at bendorius.com (Joseph C. Bender)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 08:44:04 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF0A3@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
References: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>	<4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
	<4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF0A3@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
Message-ID: <4A154C94.6050402@bendorius.com>

Novak, Louis (L.M.) wrote:
> Any thoughts on the MiFi(tm)2200 Intelligent Mobile Hotspot from
> Verizon? 
> 
> Looks like a neat device and has gotten some nice reviews:
> 
	It certainly looks nifty.  I wouldn't mind evaluating one.

	From my PoV, it's one more device that I have to worry about keeping 
charged to be able to even get on the Internet.  I'd also be worried 
about the memory limitations of such a device, especially since it only 
appears to support five users, things that generate large numbers of 
connections, such as BitTorrent could easily overwhelm it.

	That being said, it's all educated guesses on my part as I haven't 
actually played with it.

	I've used (and generally prefer) the routers where you plug the modem 
widget into the router when you need it.  In a lot of ways, that's a lot 
more simple and flexible.  It also goes back to my carrier agnostic 
strategy as well, in that if you have to swap modems, fine, but swapping 
the whole router when going to another carrier is just silly.

Cradlepoint <http://www.cradlepoint.com> makes devices that do exactly 
that.  They do have the PHS300 (which yes, does need to be charged to 
use), but you can at least bolt the modem widget to your computer if you 
need to.  I don't own one, but I've used one that a friend of mine owns. 
  It seemed to work pretty well, as an end user.  :)

-JCB



From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May 21 11:42:15 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 15:42:15 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <4A154C94.6050402@bendorius.com>
References: <4A13E583.8010004@wideopenwest.com>
	<4A140C1E.2020602@bendorius.com>
	<4CBE1DF551828442B2945670AF55254C2DF0A3@na1ecm28.ecc2.ford.com>
	<4A154C94.6050402@bendorius.com>
Message-ID: <20090521154215.2cf29d24@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Thu, 21 May 2009 08:44:04 -0400
"Joseph C. Bender" <jcbender at bendorius.com> wrote:

> Novak, Louis (L.M.) wrote:
> > Any thoughts on the MiFi(tm)2200 Intelligent Mobile Hotspot from
> > Verizon? 
> > 
> > Looks like a neat device and has gotten some nice reviews:
> > 
> 	It certainly looks nifty.  I wouldn't mind evaluating one.
> 
> 	From my PoV, it's one more device that I have to worry about
> keeping charged to be able to even get on the Internet.  I'd also be
> worried about the memory limitations of such a device, especially
> since it only appears to support five users, things that generate
> large numbers of connections, such as BitTorrent could easily
> overwhelm it.
> 
> 	That being said, it's all educated guesses on my part as I
> haven't actually played with it.
> 
> 	I've used (and generally prefer) the routers where you plug
> the modem widget into the router when you need it.  In a lot of ways,
> that's a lot more simple and flexible.  It also goes back to my
> carrier agnostic strategy as well, in that if you have to swap
> modems, fine, but swapping the whole router when going to another
> carrier is just silly.
> 
> Cradlepoint <http://www.cradlepoint.com> makes devices that do
> exactly that.  They do have the PHS300 (which yes, does need to be
> charged to use), but you can at least bolt the modem widget to your
> computer if you need to.  I don't own one, but I've used one that a
> friend of mine owns. It seemed to work pretty well, as an end
> user.  :)
> 
> -JCB
> 
	All very good and valid points. I'd have to double check the
	data limit's, but as is it's $20/month cheaper than any other
	data plan Verizon has. Maybe that's where they're going with
	this? I could easily see me hardwire one of these in my work
	truck to use. Matter of fact, it's only $10/month more than the
	crackberry data plan that I can't use anyway.
	I can see the return of convoys ;)

Best Regards,

-- 
Peter The Plumber sm
Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From gib at juno.com  Thu May 21 12:58:41 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 16:58:41 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  build-in G3 opinions
Message-ID: <20090521.125841.20365.2@webmail15.vgs.untd.com>

 
So, just an interesting thought.  I'm getting a new Blackberry that will use WiFi to connect for my voice phone use if available.  So, if many of us start to carry this MiFi thingy around with us we could share each others connection and reduce our minutes.  Since, several people at a restaurant sharing one minute for several conversations would cost less for the group as a whole.

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Novak, Louis (L.M.)" <lnovak1 at ford.com>
To: "MDLUG's Main discussion list" <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Subject: Re: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 15:10:12 -0400



Any thoughts on the MiFi(tm)2200 Intelligent Mobile Hotspot from
Verizon? 

Looks like a neat device and has gotten some nice reviews:

http://gizmodo.com/5256825/verizon-mifi-2200-3g-portable-wi+fi-hotspot-r
eview

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/07/technology/personaltech/07pogue.html?_
r=1&em

-- 
Louis Novak  lnovak1 at ford.com   (313)248-6788 
Ford Motor Co., IT Learning & Organizational Development
Eco-Tip: Bottled water is a waste of money and resources. 
Drink tap water from a reusable container instead. 

_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

____________________________________________________________
Click here to find the perfect banking opportunity!
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsKoDPprxwSj9tMLgGQ7jiNrs83TuTaSNJiopsTDEM3FTs733Ubjn6/


From gib at juno.com  Thu May 21 13:00:03 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 17:00:03 GMT
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
Message-ID: <20090521.130003.20365.3@webmail15.vgs.untd.com>

 
I'm getting a Blackberry and I wonder if you could explain to me your comment about the data plan.  I'm going to use AT&T.

---------- Original Message ----------
From: Peter Bart <peter at petertheplumber.net>
To: mdlug at mdlug.org
Subject: Re: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 15:42:15 +0000

On Thu, 21 May 2009 08:44:04 -0400
"Joseph C. Bender" <jcbender at bendorius.com> wrote:

> Novak, Louis (L.M.) wrote:
> > Any thoughts on the MiFi(tm)2200 Intelligent Mobile Hotspot from
> > Verizon? 
> > 
> > Looks like a neat device and has gotten some nice reviews:
> > 
> It certainly looks nifty.  I wouldn't mind evaluating one.
> 
> From my PoV, it's one more device that I have to worry about
> keeping charged to be able to even get on the Internet.  I'd also be
> worried about the memory limitations of such a device, especially
> since it only appears to support five users, things that generate
> large numbers of connections, such as BitTorrent could easily
> overwhelm it.
> 
> That being said, it's all educated guesses on my part as I
> haven't actually played with it.
> 
> I've used (and generally prefer) the routers where you plug
> the modem widget into the router when you need it.  In a lot of ways,
> that's a lot more simple and flexible.  It also goes back to my
> carrier agnostic strategy as well, in that if you have to swap
> modems, fine, but swapping the whole router when going to another
> carrier is just silly.
> 
> Cradlepoint <http://www.cradlepoint.com> makes devices that do
> exactly that.  They do have the PHS300 (which yes, does need to be
> charged to use), but you can at least bolt the modem widget to your
> computer if you need to.  I don't own one, but I've used one that a
> friend of mine owns. It seemed to work pretty well, as an end
> user.  :)
> 
> -JCB
> 
All very good and valid points. I'd have to double check the
data limit's, but as is it's $20/month cheaper than any other
data plan Verizon has. Maybe that's where they're going with
this? I could easily see me hardwire one of these in my work
truck to use. Matter of fact, it's only $10/month more than the
crackberry data plan that I can't use anyway.
I can see the return of convoys ;)

Best Regards,

-- 
Peter The Plumber sm
Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

____________________________________________________________
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From fulner at gmail.com  Thu May 21 14:45:38 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 14:45:38 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
Message-ID: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>

I have tried several times in the past few months, especially lately, to set
up Evolution to check my exchange e-mail from work. I have tried on XP SP3,
Vista Ultimate, and my home PC Xubuntu 8.10.

I have not been successful at all. I'm guess its my error, but it might not
be. On the Linux box, i've entered all the information, to best of my
ability.

my address is jim.fulner at parrot.com

I access my Web Account from https://mail.xi-lite.com/exchange

So I have entered that as my OWA URL as well as a few variations suggested
on various Linux Forum sites.

my user name I've tried both as jim.fulner at parrot.com and jim.fulner

on the Windows machine I never get pas the authentication step.

I was wondering if this has anything to do with the fact for the past
several months, at least 6, if I try to check my email via web I get an
error about how the website certificate is out of date, and I need to
authorize an exception and that good businesses should not require you to do
so. Of course, now that I'm typing this, I'm not getting the error on the
web to give you the exact wording, damn Microsoft.

So am I missing something else, is there a major PICNIC error that I missed
(problem in chair not in computer) or is this a communication error with my
exchange server?

-- 
Jim Fulner
Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
PO Box 252762
West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
715-419-0445 (cell)

http://www.lpocmi.org
Join our Group on Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts

"Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""


From jcbender at bendorius.com  Thu May 21 15:42:30 2009
From: jcbender at bendorius.com (Joseph C. Bender)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 15:42:30 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A15AEA6.8090700@bendorius.com>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> I have tried several times in the past few months, especially lately, to set
> up Evolution to check my exchange e-mail from work. I have tried on XP SP3,
> Vista Ultimate, and my home PC Xubuntu 8.10.
> 
	If it's Exchange 2k7 on the backend, it will fail hard.  You need a 
bolt-on for Evolution (the name of which escapes me) to make it work right.

-JCB


From micorral at comcast.net  Thu May 21 16:04:26 2009
From: micorral at comcast.net (Michael Corral)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 16:04:26 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905211601530.3095@banana.sluggo.net>

2009-05-21, Monsieur Robert Jim Fulner a ?crit:
<snip>
> Jim Fulner
> Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
> PO Box 252762
> West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
> 715-419-0445 (cell)
>
> http://www.lpocmi.org
> Join our Group on Facebook:
> http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts
>
> "Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""

WTF??

Michael

From billings at negate.org  Thu May 21 17:48:55 2009
From: billings at negate.org (Jonathan Billings)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 17:48:55 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <4A15AEA6.8090700@bendorius.com>
References: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A15AEA6.8090700@bendorius.com>
Message-ID: <20090521214855.GG27667@meson.local>

On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 03:42:30PM -0400, Joseph C. Bender wrote:
> Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> > I have tried several times in the past few months, especially lately, to set
> > up Evolution to check my exchange e-mail from work. I have tried on XP SP3,
> > Vista Ultimate, and my home PC Xubuntu 8.10.
> > 
> 	If it's Exchange 2k7 on the backend, it will fail hard.  You need a 
> bolt-on for Evolution (the name of which escapes me) to make it work right.

There's a newer plugin for Evolution that uses OpenChange
(http://www.openchange.org/) that uses the native MAPI protocol rather
than going through the exchange web client.  I doubt it's in *buntu
8.10 or even 9.04.  I plan to test it once Fedora 11 is released.

-- 
Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>


From mdbader at flash.net  Thu May 21 19:16:32 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 19:16:32 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Looking for suggested brand of PCI video card(s) for
 Compaq Alpha and Debian
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3C6@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <4A130EB4.9070100@flash.net><319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3BC@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>	<4A15434F.4090208@flash.net>
	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3C6@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <4A15E0D0.9040304@flash.net>



On 5/21/2009 8:32 AM, Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>> From: mike bader
>>      
>
>    
>> On 5/20/2009 8:09 AM, Ingles, Raymond wrote:
>>      
>>> I think I can dig up a Matrox card that's supposed to work.
>>>        
>> thanks.
>> I have access to some cards, but it is hit and miss, and not certain
>> that they work, and I may  have to go out and find drivers.
>>      
>
>   Okay, it's a PCI Matrox Millennium. Should be around 4MB VRAM. Matrox
> cards were always well-supported in Linux, so I think you should be good
> - that web page seems to indicate so. (I also have a 4MB PCI Riva 128,
> but I don't think that'll work on an Alpha.) If you want either, they're
> yours, just let me know.
>
>   Sincerely,
>
>   Ray Ingles                                     (313) 227-2317
>
>   "Imagine a cluster of Windows machines. They'd have to have a
>      team of MCSE's equipped with roller skates, just to keep
>             pressing reset buttons." - Peter Jensen
> The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>    

Yes please, I'd like to give them a try

thanks

mike bader


From muteid10t at gmail.com  Thu May 21 19:59:49 2009
From: muteid10t at gmail.com (Ron Blanchett)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 19:59:49 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <20090521214855.GG27667@meson.local>
References: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A15AEA6.8090700@bendorius.com> <20090521214855.GG27667@meson.local>
Message-ID: <52995d720905211659w40eed24bs693fd10e42d6e25a@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/21/09, Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org> wrote:
>
> There's a newer plugin for Evolution that uses OpenChange
> (http://www.openchange.org/) that uses the native MAPI protocol rather
> than going through the exchange web client.  I doubt it's in *buntu
> 8.10 or even 9.04.  I plan to test it once Fedora 11 is released.
>
>
> --
> Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>
>

The new plugin is in all of the buntu's starting with 9.04, I have not tried
it yet though.


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Fri May 22 00:27:34 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 00:27:34 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <20090521214855.GG27667@meson.local> (message from Jonathan
	Billings on Thu, 21 May 2009 17:48:55 -0400)
References: <c768576f0905211145i131ab00ejf2e52567d4403d85@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A15AEA6.8090700@bendorius.com> <20090521214855.GG27667@meson.local>
Message-ID: <20090522042734.D8B7720AAEC@starfox.local>

Jim, Joseph,

>> I have tried several times in the past few months, especially lately, to set
>> up Evolution to check my exchange e-mail from work. I have tried on XP SP3,
>> Vista Ultimate, and my home PC Xubuntu 8.10.

I've been using evolution for the last year with mail from our company
exchange system.  It has worked >90% of the time, but on several days,
it has been unable to pick up or send any mail.

The failure symptoms have included
  o headers read, but content pane remains blank
  o password dialog remaining open, and a "window not responding"
    dialog appears with the offer to terminate
  o evolution reporting loss of connection with exchange,
    re-established only after quitting evolution, running killev
    and starting evolution again
  o repeating any or all of the above several times
Over the last year, I have begun to associate the failure with
high network load, and the above procedures seems to merely occupy
time, until the net load drops.

Recently, I have noted that access via firefox is often instructive,
sometimes timing out as well, or sometimes supplying an error
message.

Though unproven, I have begun to suspect that when the connection
is lost, the exchange server remembers the client ip and
increases the delays in future connections (for about 24hr).
My coworkers use the word "rolling black hole" to refer
to a similar phenomenon.

My workaround is to wait until after business hours (or the
network load otherwise drops) before trying to restore a connection.

Hopefully helpful,
-- 
Bob

  "The real danger is not that computers will begin to think like men,
   but that men will begin to think like computers."
     -- Sydney J. Harris


From peter at petertheplumber.net  Fri May 22 03:22:25 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 07:22:25 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] build-in G3 opinions
In-Reply-To: <20090521.130003.20365.3@webmail15.vgs.untd.com>
References: <20090521.130003.20365.3@webmail15.vgs.untd.com>
Message-ID: <20090522072225.75bd0c4e@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Thu, 21 May 2009 17:00:03 GMT
"gib at juno.com" <gib at juno.com> wrote:

>  
> I'm getting a Blackberry and I wonder if you could explain to me your
> comment about the data plan.  I'm going to use AT&T.
> 

	I use Verizon for now, they have two levels of data plans for
	Blackberry's. One; which I have; is $30/month and the other is
	$60/month in addition to the voice plan. I cannot tether and
	Verizon's TOS explicitly forbids it for my plan. I cannot opt
	out of these add ons, I must pay for one or the other. That's
	to much for me to swallow on top of a $100/month voice plan.
	What do they care what device I use for data, as long as I pay
	for it? That's what appeals to me about this router/modem. I
	can use any device I want. I should point out that Verizon
	puts their own firmware on the handsets they sell, except for
	smart phones. I gladly pay for
	the extra to gain some functionality that they disable in their
	other handsets. I will not be doing that much longer. I may get
	one of these router/modems. I will certainly; from now on; never
	take one of their handsets. I will buy my handsets elsewhere;
	to keep the functionality they program out; and possibly still
	activate on their network. I've had it with being tied into one
	or the other carrier. Verizon in particular intentionally
	cripples the functionality of the handsets they sell, so they
	can sell you add ons. I would be very interested in your
	experiences with ATT.  

Best Regards,

-- 
Peter The Plumber sm

Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From box at blogdetroit.com  Sat May 23 00:02:57 2009
From: box at blogdetroit.com (marytee)
Date: Sat, 23 May 2009 00:02:57 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Selling software
In-Reply-To: <006301c9d966$b3cfee50$1b6fcaf0$@net>
References: <006301c9d966$b3cfee50$1b6fcaf0$@net>
Message-ID: <4A177571.3050206@blogdetroit.com>

Well, you can try Hoover's -- http://hoovers.com/free/

Identify your demographic (alpha sort or by geography) then click the 
link to download the Excel file. You have a choice to pick the fields 
you want. I tested it and it seems to work.


Andrew Koper wrote:
> I need lots of large lists of contact information for companies - all
> different industries and geographic areas.  Dun and Bradstreet has a
> database of the companies that make up the U.S. economy, but they charge $$
> for that info.  Where and how can I get that information online?
>
>  
>
> Are there people on this list that have experience selling software to
> companies?  I would like to take you out to lunch and pick your brain for
> advice on how to do that.
>
>  
>
> ____________________
>
>  
>
> Andrew Koper
>
> Founder & CEO
>
> work-flow.biz
>
> PO Box 32838
>
> Detroit, MI 48232
>
> p: 313-554-1060
>
> e: akoper at work-flow.biz
>
>  
>
>  
>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>   


From amdavis at wideopenwest.com  Sun May 24 00:52:47 2009
From: amdavis at wideopenwest.com (Adam Davis)
Date: Sun, 24 May 2009 00:52:47 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] MS patents OS crippling
In-Reply-To: <4A146321.903@gmail.com>
References: <14053022.1242833147041.JavaMail.root@elwamui-milano.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<4A146321.903@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200905240052.47534.amdavis@wideopenwest.com>

On Wednesday 20 May 2009, Aaron Kulkis wrote:
> R. Kannan wrote:
> > In case you haven't seen this, MS has patented the tools for extortion:
> >
> > "On Tuesday, Microsoft was granted US Patent No. 7,536,726 (it was
> > ... snipped ...
> > http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PAL
> >L&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=7,536,726.PN.&OS
> >=PN/7,536,726&RS=PN/7,536,726
>
> "until an 'agreed upon sum of money' is paid to 'unlock or otherwise make
> available the restricted functionality.'"
>
> In a closed source world, the technology to do this is trivial,
> and therefore fails the obviousness test.
>
> So it sounds more like a business methods patent to me -- all
> of which were effectively rendered worthless at the appeals
> court level last fall.  SCOTUS has allowed the counter-appeal
> onto the docket -- I don't expect business methods to survive
> their scrutiny, and software patents might get wiped out by
> them, too, as both business methods and therefore algorithms
> were allowed ONLY due to a peculiar ruling by a court back
> in the 1990's, but in complete contradiction to both the
> letter and the spirit of the Constitutional clause which
> mandates that the federal government grant patents and
> copyrights (the current duration of copyright ALSO violates
> the clause which states "for limited periods of time" --
> Life of Author + 20 years wasn't ever considered until
> Mickey Mouse came in danger of falling into public domain,
> and certainly not even during the early years of the country,
> when life expectancy was below 50.
>
> I doubt anyone will challenge this patent, though,
> because it's worthless.  Even IBM stopped making
> crippler-cards for their computers (the cards
> would tie up the bus for a technician-selectable
> percentage of the time) back in the 70's.  Getting
> your mainframe upgraded (i.e. to higher throughput)
> REALLY meant paying for an IBM technician to come
> and pull the card OUT of the mainframe.
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

Well, I agree with your main point, that this patent fails the obviousness 
test. I also hope that these 'business method'-type patents are now 
worthless. But I'm not sure about your assertion that IBM has stopped using 
these kind of tactics. A few years ago when I was working on IBM midrange 
systems (variously known as System i, iSeries, or AS/400 computers), IBM 
restricted the 'interactive capacity' of those systems. These systems 
contained what they called an an "Interactive Feature", where if you paid 
IBM more they would allow your system to use a higher percentage of its CPU 
capacity for interactive jobs (5250 terminal sessions). This was ofen 
referred to as the "interactive tax". Exceeding the percentage you had paid 
for would kick off an OS-controlled job that would dramatically slow down 
your system.

So IBM could have a problem with this patent, depending on how its worded. I 
don't think its something they would want to challenge, however. I don't 
think they have much to gain by highlighting their prior art in this area.


From gib at juno.com  Sat May 23 22:49:59 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Sun, 24 May 2009 02:49:59 GMT
Subject: [mdlug] Need Help with MAc Screen Swap - Anybody Authorized to
	Repair Macs?
Message-ID: <20090523.224959.25896.1@webmail09.vgs.untd.com>

  	
Got this from a neighbor.  Anyone authorized to repair a Mac who could swap a screen?

:-)


Gibson,

Hate to bother you on this beautiful weekend.. . . . . .

Our son flew home this weekend and will be going back to California Monday, to finish his semester/and upcoming Finals.....  In the airport security he dropped his 15" MacPro, less than a year old Laptop, damaged the flip up screen.  Tom & Nathan went to apple Novi this morning and the best we can do is order a replacement screen, it will arrive tomorrow, Sunday.  Apple says you have to have it installed, to maintain our three year warranty.  I have used MacProfessionals in Novi before, but they only work Monday thru Friday, and since it is a holiday will not be open until Tuesday.  Therefore the plan is to take it there Tuesday morning, get it changed and overnight it back to California. 
Big risk, with his upcoming finals.........
 
I thought, maybe by chance, Do you have a Geek friend who may be authorized to swap the screen before 8 a.m. Monday ?  Just thought I'd ask......

Thanks, Sandy McKenty


____________________________________________________________
Learning Centers - Click Here.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsIpv1SqQJfPfj7yBUgx8rO6JvcGin9FtD0GTJkLp1lk1MAeTq5PgM/


From driveray at ameritech.net  Tue May 26 09:45:57 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Tue, 26 May 2009 09:45:57 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] SEMCO Sig-Linux meeting Oak Park Library 6:45 Tonight
Message-ID: <4A1BF295.80400@ameritech.net>

SEMCO Sig-Linux meeting Oak Park Library 6:45 Tonight
First meeting general discussion, organization and planning.

> mike bader wrote:
>> Where: Oak Park Library, 14200 Oak Park Blvd., Oak Park, Michigan. Oak
>> Park Blvd. is 9.5 mile road and the library is west of Coolidge. Ask at
>> the library about the room assignment.
>> 
>> When: 4th Tuesday 6:45-8:45pm
>> 
>> After the meetings some of us meet for a bite to eat at
>> 
>> O'Mara's
>> SW corner of 12 Mile&  Coolidge
>> 2555 12 Mile Rd
>> Berkley, MI 48072
>> (248)399-6750
>> www.omaras.net
>> 
>> Mike Bader
>> 
>> 



From Stan at mcomputersolutions.com  Wed May 27 20:29:49 2009
From: Stan at mcomputersolutions.com (Stan Green)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 20:29:49 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
Message-ID: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>

I know this subject comes up from time to time, but things change over time. 
(i.e. providers come and go.)

I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am not 
interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who I have been 
very happy with. However they seem a little high in price, $60+/month. I put 
up with the price to get a static IP address and allowed to run servers. I am 
moving my web site to a hosting provider, so I no longer need a static IP 
address or to run a server.

I am looking for good performance at a lower price point. Does anyone have 
experience with a good DSL provider. I'm OK with acting like a normal Windows 
users to get it set up. (I don't need to tell them I use Linux as long as it 
still work after setup.)

Thanks,
Stan


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Wed May 27 21:22:05 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 21:22:05 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
Message-ID: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

I have AT&T (1.5 - 3Mbps)and have not had any problems for past three years. I had one outage for 6 hrs during that time. But if you are looking for good knowlegeable support, forget it. The tech support does not know anything other than 'reboot the windows'

-----Original Message-----
>From: Stan Green <Stan at mcomputersolutions.com>
>Sent: May 27, 2009 8:29 PM
>To: MDLUG <mdlug at mdlug.org>
>Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
>
>I know this subject comes up from time to time, but things change over time. 
>(i.e. providers come and go.)
>
>I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am not 
>interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who I have been 
>very happy with. However they seem a little high in price, $60+/month. I put 
>up with the price to get a static IP address and allowed to run servers. I am 
>moving my web site to a hosting provider, so I no longer need a static IP 
>address or to run a server.
>
>I am looking for good performance at a lower price point. Does anyone have 
>experience with a good DSL provider. I'm OK with acting like a normal Windows 
>users to get it set up. (I don't need to tell them I use Linux as long as it 
>still work after setup.)
>
>Thanks,
>Stan
>_______________________________________________
>mdlug mailing list
>mdlug at mdlug.org
>http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From relson at osagesoftware.com  Wed May 27 21:44:02 2009
From: relson at osagesoftware.com (David Relson)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 21:44:02 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>
References: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>
Message-ID: <20090527214402.21283daf@osage.osagesoftware.com>

On Wed, 27 May 2009 20:29:49 -0400
Stan Green wrote:

> I know this subject comes up from time to time, but things change
> over time. (i.e. providers come and go.)
> 
> I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am
> not interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who
> I have been very happy with. However they seem a little high in
> price, $60+/month. I put up with the price to get a static IP address
> and allowed to run servers. I am moving my web site to a hosting
> provider, so I no longer need a static IP address or to run a server.
> 
> I am looking for good performance at a lower price point. Does anyone
> have experience with a good DSL provider. I'm OK with acting like a
> normal Windows users to get it set up. (I don't need to tell them I
> use Linux as long as it still work after setup.)
> 
> Thanks,
> Stan

I've used DigitalRealm since DirectTV dropped out of the DSL business
about 6 1/2 years ago.  They're linux friendly, offer static addresses
(if needed), reasonably reliable, and are local (Ann Arbor).

David


From dand at zifferent.net  Wed May 27 22:06:29 2009
From: dand at zifferent.net (Dan DeSloover)
Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 22:06:29 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink
	.net>
References: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <59050.10.1.1.111.1243476389.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>

I'm also with AT&T and use their 3Mbps service and I couldn't be happier.
In 7 or 8 eight years it's gone down twice unscheduled for a few hours
each time. I run my own web and mail server and all I had to do is contact
them to open up incoming SMTP (I route outgoing through their SMTP server
so that I don't get labeled spam.)

I've recently jumped into their Uverse offering which is all digital
phone, TV and Internet.

I won't go cable because they are such enormous douchebags about blocking
ports, running home servers and using routers and switches behind their
equipment.

R. Kannan wrote:
> I have AT&T (1.5 - 3Mbps)and have not had any problems for past three
> years. I had one outage for 6 hrs during that time. But if you are looking
> for good knowlegeable support, forget it. The tech support does not know
> anything other than 'reboot the windows'
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Stan Green <Stan at mcomputersolutions.com>
>>Sent: May 27, 2009 8:29 PM
>>To: MDLUG <mdlug at mdlug.org>
>>Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
>>
>>I know this subject comes up from time to time, but things change over
>> time.
>>(i.e. providers come and go.)
>>
>>I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am not
>>interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who I have
>> been
>>very happy with. However they seem a little high in price, $60+/month. I
>> put
>>up with the price to get a static IP address and allowed to run servers.
>> I am
>>moving my web site to a hosting provider, so I no longer need a static IP
>>address or to run a server.
>>
>>I am looking for good performance at a lower price point. Does anyone
>> have
>>experience with a good DSL provider. I'm OK with acting like a normal
>> Windows
>>users to get it set up. (I don't need to tell them I use Linux as long as
>> it
>>still work after setup.)
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Stan
>>_______________________________________________
>>mdlug mailing list
>>mdlug at mdlug.org
>>http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>
> ________________________________________
> PeoplePC Online
> A better way to Internet
> http://www.peoplepc.com
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>


----
Dan DeSloover
dand at zifferent.net



From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May 28 05:22:18 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 09:22:18 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20090528092218.0199ec66@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Wed, 27 May 2009 21:22:05 -0400 (EDT)
"R. Kannan" <rkannan at peoplepc.com> wrote:

> I have AT&T (1.5 - 3Mbps)and have not had any problems for past three
> years. I had one outage for 6 hrs during that time. But if you are
> looking for good knowlegeable support, forget it. The tech support
> does not know anything other than 'reboot the windows'

	I second that about ATT, except that tech support is getting
	more Linux friendly. The last problem I had over a year
	ago;with getting mail; was solved after I refused to reboot.

Best Regards,
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm

Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May 28 05:22:18 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 09:22:18 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20090528092218.0199ec66@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Wed, 27 May 2009 21:22:05 -0400 (EDT)
"R. Kannan" <rkannan at peoplepc.com> wrote:

> I have AT&T (1.5 - 3Mbps)and have not had any problems for past three
> years. I had one outage for 6 hrs during that time. But if you are
> looking for good knowlegeable support, forget it. The tech support
> does not know anything other than 'reboot the windows'

	I second that about ATT, except that tech support is getting
	more Linux friendly. The last problem I had over a year
	ago;with getting mail; was solved after I refused to reboot.

Best Regards,
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm

Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From audiotech50 at gmail.com  Thu May 28 11:40:31 2009
From: audiotech50 at gmail.com (Michael Rudas)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 15:40:31 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>
References: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>
Message-ID: <b67fb0380905280840x66b451abhc20983580a8e91b8@mail.gmail.com>

--- Stan Green wrote:

> I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am not
> interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who I have been
> very happy with.

Realize that no matter who your "provider" is, all provisioning
(hardware) is provided by AT & T.  They now have "naked" DSL for as
little as $20 a month.  I've been a customer for 7 years, starting at
768kbps.  I currently have 6Mbps service with them--I'm looking into
the new 18 Mbps service...

~~ Michael Rudas
    My home page: http://MRudas.2Ya.com
    My Protopage links: http://TinyURL.com/3wt54n


From rkannan at peoplepc.com  Thu May 28 13:00:10 2009
From: rkannan at peoplepc.com (R. Kannan)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 13:00:10 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
Message-ID: <14048061.1243530011040.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net>


-----Original Message-----
>From: Michael Rudas <audiotech50 at gmail.com>
>Sent: May 28, 2009 11:40 AM
>To: Stan at mcomputersolutions.com, MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
>Subject: Re: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
>
>--- Stan Green wrote:
>
>> I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am not
>> interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy, who I have been
>> very happy with.
>
>Realize that no matter who your "provider" is, all provisioning
>(hardware) is provided by AT & T.  They now have "naked" DSL for as
>little as $20 a month.  I've been a customer for 7 years, starting at
>768kbps.  I currently have 6Mbps service with them--I'm looking into
>the new 18 Mbps service...

Just out of curiosity, how much do they charge for 6Mbps or 18 Mbps service ? Do you actually get the advertised speed?
>
>~~ Michael Rudas
>    My home page: http://MRudas.2Ya.com
>    My Protopage links: http://TinyURL.com/3wt54n
>_______________________________________________
>mdlug mailing list
>mdlug at mdlug.org
>http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com


From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May 28 12:58:12 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:58:12 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <b67fb0380905280840x66b451abhc20983580a8e91b8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200905272029.49272.Stan@mcomputersolutions.com>
	<b67fb0380905280840x66b451abhc20983580a8e91b8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090528165812.2cd1db59@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Thu, 28 May 2009 15:40:31 +0000
Michael Rudas <audiotech50 at gmail.com> wrote:

> --- Stan Green wrote:
> 
> > I am looking to switch my DSL provider. (I don't have cable and am
> > not interested in going that route.) I am currently on SpeakEasy,
> > who I have been very happy with.
> 
> Realize that no matter who your "provider" is, all provisioning
> (hardware) is provided by AT & T.  They now have "naked" DSL for as
> little as $20 a month.  I've been a customer for 7 years, starting at
> 768kbps.  I currently have 6Mbps service with them--I'm looking into
> the new 18 Mbps service...
> 

	Would the 18Mbps bandwidth be the one that is offered bundled
	as Uverse? If so, can it be ordered separate or must it be
	bundled? I'm curious to see what you find out and what the
	pricing is.

Best Regards,
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm
Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From fulner at gmail.com  Thu May 28 13:34:30 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 13:34:30 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
Message-ID: <c768576f0905281034l7bba2efbq9fea405e672965d5@mail.gmail.com>

My wife has an HP Laptop (not sure the model off hand) that she bought at
*cough Wal-Mart *cough. Before we were married (2007). As a typical Windoze
user she got really frustrated at it, (wasn't printing) and hit the device
and damaged the hard disk. Well at least that my assumption the unit stopped
dead in its track, wont' boot from the hard disk and when it attempts to do
so it just clicks really loud and repeatedly. I can boot from USB or LIve CD
(with about 20% of the time able to read/write mount her Hard Disk once in
X). So, I guess it gets here threw the day, she kinda likes Puppy. I've
never been able to get the wireless to recognize this way, granted I've
never been good with networking. If someone has a suggestion on getting that
working, I'd be willing to listen ever google search and forum post I read
is no avail. That being said that's not the main reason I'm writing.

As I've never switched components on a laptop before, only a desktop, I was
wondering what I need to be looking for at a functional, though fairly
inexpensive, hard drive for her. Does anybody perhaps have one lying in a
basement they could part with for a reasonable fee? Or at least point me in
the right direction.


From fulner at gmail.com  Thu May 28 14:22:50 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 14:22:50 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
Message-ID: <c768576f0905281122t2df47b61v386ce53e5e19512a@mail.gmail.com>

> If it's Exchange 2k7 on the backend, it will fail hard.
I've read that sevearl times and always assumed I had Exchange 2003, simply
because our default application at work is MS Outlook 2003. Looking back on
it now, that was a pretty stupid assumption as the two are propably
unrelated. I'm not sure how I'd determine that for certain. "My IT" guys are
all in France, so that's not very reasonable, and if I do ask them for this
kind of info via e-mail, or from "our computer" guy (the tech support
manager) I usally get a response along the line of:

"you don't need to know that, quit using that hippie freeware"
"uhm, its not freeware"
"whatever"

> There's a newer plugin for Evolution that uses OpenChange
(http://www.openchange.org/) that uses the native MAPI protocol rather
than going through the exchange web client.  I doubt it's in *buntu
8.10 or even 9.04.  I plan to test it once Fedora 11 is released.

What's the MAPI protocol? that sounds interesting. I'm thinking about
switching distros anyways, *buntu is beginning to bore me, and each time  I
"upgrade" it seems less functional and crashes more, I really like the new
Knoppix, and as such trying to find a good LXDE native distro, any
suggestions?

> The new plugin is in all of the buntu's starting with 9.04, I have not
tried
it yet though.

How would i go about getting that it doesn't automatically update, and I
thought I already had all of the evolution add on's per Synaptic.

> My workaround is to wait until after business hours (or the
network load otherwise drops) before trying to restore a connection.


Bob, most every time I try to access is "after hours" but as a fairly small
company >500, but spread out around 35 countries, there isn't really an
"after hours time"

-- 
Jim Fulner
Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
PO Box 252762
West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
715-419-0445 (cell)

http://www.lpocmi.org
Join our Group on Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts

"Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""


From tesral at wowway.com  Thu May 28 14:39:53 2009
From: tesral at wowway.com (Garry Stahl)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 14:39:53 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905281034l7bba2efbq9fea405e672965d5@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281034l7bba2efbq9fea405e672965d5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A1EDA79.1040405@wowway.com>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> As I've never switched components on a laptop before, only a desktop, I was
> wondering what I need to be looking for at a functional, though fairly
> inexpensive, hard drive for her. Does anybody perhaps have one lying in a
> basement they could part with for a reasonable fee? Or at least point me in
> the right direction.
>   

What size range?  Laptops are not scary as long as you take a few steps.

1:  Get the service manual.  They all open up differently.  Even the
same maker will change things drastically between models.  They should
be available as a PDF on line.

2:  A clear work area with a nice little cup for the tiny screws.

3:  Go slowly.  Haste makes doorstops.

Changeling a hard drive should not be major surgery.  They are not an
arm and a leg anymore. 

-- 
Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.

Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org



From billings at negate.org  Thu May 28 14:48:49 2009
From: billings at negate.org (Jonathan Billings)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 14:48:49 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905281122t2df47b61v386ce53e5e19512a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281122t2df47b61v386ce53e5e19512a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090528184848.GA30784@rhea.lsait.lsa.umich.edu>

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 02:22:50PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> What's the MAPI protocol? that sounds interesting. I'm thinking about
> switching distros anyways, *buntu is beginning to bore me, and each time  I
> "upgrade" it seems less functional and crashes more, I really like the new
> Knoppix, and as such trying to find a good LXDE native distro, any
> suggestions?

Wikipedia has a good MAPI article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAPI

I think there's an evolution-mapi package in jaunty that you need to
use it.  The evolution-exchange one uses the webmail component of
Exchange, which is what's breaking.
-- 
Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>


From radkins at impelind.com  Thu May 28 14:43:23 2009
From: radkins at impelind.com (Robert Adkins)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 14:43:23 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <4A1EDA79.1040405@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <20090528191332.ABABEC0C6@impelind.com>


Laptop HDs aren't complicated to replace.

There's a new computer store called Computer Direct on John R just south of
14 Mile between Wendy's and Firestone. They have a number of laptop HDs on
hand and will match or beat the prices of any other computer component
seller in the area.

They are a local Michigan company with plans on expanding to several
additional locations across South East Michigan. If you are going to buy a
new drive, give them a look, they intend on sticking around and investing in
Michigan.

Here's their website:
www.computerdirectcorp.com

-Rob


> -----Original Message-----
> From: mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org 
> [mailto:mdlug-bounces at mdlug.org] On Behalf Of Garry Stahl
> Sent: Thursday, May 28, 2009 2:40 PM
> To: MDLUG's Main discussion list
> Subject: Re: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
> 
> Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> > As I've never switched components on a laptop before, only 
> a desktop, 
> > I was wondering what I need to be looking for at a 
> functional, though 
> > fairly inexpensive, hard drive for her. Does anybody 
> perhaps have one 
> > lying in a basement they could part with for a reasonable 
> fee? Or at 
> > least point me in the right direction.
> >   
> 
> What size range?  Laptops are not scary as long as you take a 
> few steps.
> 
> 1:  Get the service manual.  They all open up differently.  
> Even the same maker will change things drastically between 
> models.  They should be available as a PDF on line.
> 
> 2:  A clear work area with a nice little cup for the tiny screws.
> 
> 3:  Go slowly.  Haste makes doorstops.
> 
> Changeling a hard drive should not be major surgery.  They 
> are not an arm and a leg anymore. 
> 
> --
> Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.
> 
> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes Star Trek mort. 
> Viva la Star Trek admiraetur The Olde Phoenix Inn 
> http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com Metro Detroit Linux Users Group 
> http://www.mdlug.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
> 



From gib at juno.com  Thu May 28 14:57:28 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 18:57:28 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  laptop harddrive
Message-ID: <20090528.145728.8356.2@webmail24.vgs.untd.com>

 
Yes.  I have an old laptop hardrive that I can sell you cheap. It's, I think, a 6 gig.  Can you give me, say $20 for it?
I will be at the Panara Bread in Dearborn Heights on ford Road just West of Beach Daily (East of Inkster Road).  I plan to arrive about 6:20 PM.  
Or you can meet me at the MDLUG meeting the second Saturday of the month.
Or you can find me at the MUG.org meeting the second Tuesday of the month.
I have a long list of other events through the weekend. See me Saturday at the DearbornHills.org picnic or the Cobra meet near Ford world headquarters.
Just reply back and we'll set something up.

---------- Original Message ----------
From: Robert Jim Fulner <fulner at gmail.com>
To: mdlug at mdlug.org
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 13:34:30 -0400

My wife has an HP Laptop (not sure the model off hand) that she bought at
*cough Wal-Mart *cough. Before we were married (2007). As a typical Windoze
user she got really frustrated at it, (wasn't printing) and hit the device
and damaged the hard disk. Well at least that my assumption the unit stopped
dead in its track, wont' boot from the hard disk and when it attempts to do
so it just clicks really loud and repeatedly. I can boot from USB or LIve CD
(with about 20% of the time able to read/write mount her Hard Disk once in
X). So, I guess it gets here threw the day, she kinda likes Puppy. I've
never been able to get the wireless to recognize this way, granted I've
never been good with networking. If someone has a suggestion on getting that
working, I'd be willing to listen ever google search and forum post I read
is no avail. That being said that's not the main reason I'm writing.

As I've never switched components on a laptop before, only a desktop, I was
wondering what I need to be looking for at a functional, though fairly
inexpensive, hard drive for her. Does anybody perhaps have one lying in a
basement they could part with for a reasonable fee? Or at least point me in
the right direction.
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

____________________________________________________________
Free information - Best Cell Phones and Plans. Click now!
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsI5pdj7QuYnoXhFwvJM5nyx4pPFw8fn0rVd5DgtP8KKqljjLRzMB6/


From fulner at gmail.com  Thu May 28 14:59:56 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 14:59:56 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
Message-ID: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>

She currently has a 55 GB, I'm sure I wouldn't need more than that as
she has not used up most of that already. If you ask my wife she'll
tell you she needs much larger, I'm sure. I tried to talk her out of
the 500 GB external, and she went ahead and got it 2 years ago,
currently with less than 10 gigs of stuf on it. (Not the least of
which is me backing mup my /home directory each time I upgrade,
without her knowledge of course).

>What size range?  Laptops are not scary as long as you take a few steps.

1:  Get the service manual.  They all open up differently.  Even the
same maker will change things drastically between models.  They should
be available as a PDF on line.

2:  A clear work area with a nice little cup for the tiny screws.

3:  Go slowly.  Haste makes doorstops.

Changeling a hard drive should not be major surgery.  They are not an
arm and a leg anymore.



-- 
Jim Fulner
Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
PO Box 252762
West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
715-419-0445 (cell)

http://www.lpocmi.org
Join our Group on Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts

"Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""


From tesral at wowway.com  Thu May 28 15:07:09 2009
From: tesral at wowway.com (Garry Stahl)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 15:07:09 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>

Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> She currently has a 55 GB, I'm sure I wouldn't need more than that as
> she has not used up most of that already. If you ask my wife she'll
> tell you she needs much larger, I'm sure. I tried to talk her out of
> the 500 GB external, and she went ahead and got it 2 years ago,
> currently with less than 10 gigs of stuf on it. (Not the least of
> which is me backing mup my /home directory each time I upgrade,
> without her knowledge of course).
>   

I have nothing in that range.  You also have to know SATA of EIDE.  They
are not interchangeable.  Getting the hard drive out it will be
obvious.  SATA has the narrow little plug, IDE is a wide one.

Find out what you need.  Get same, replace.

-- 
Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.

Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org



From dand at zifferent.net  Thu May 28 16:03:29 2009
From: dand at zifferent.net (Dan DeSloover)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:03:29 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>
	<4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>

Not only that every laptop I've worked on has an easy access panel (4-6
screws) to the hard drive bay and maybe another three screws to remove the
hard drive.

Garry Stahl wrote:
> Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>> She currently has a 55 GB, I'm sure I wouldn't need more than that as
>> she has not used up most of that already. If you ask my wife she'll
>> tell you she needs much larger, I'm sure. I tried to talk her out of
>> the 500 GB external, and she went ahead and got it 2 years ago,
>> currently with less than 10 gigs of stuf on it. (Not the least of
>> which is me backing mup my /home directory each time I upgrade,
>> without her knowledge of course).
>>
>
> I have nothing in that range.  You also have to know SATA of EIDE.  They
> are not interchangeable.  Getting the hard drive out it will be
> obvious.  SATA has the narrow little plug, IDE is a wide one.
>
> Find out what you need.  Get same, replace.
>
> --
> Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.
>
> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
> Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
> The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
> Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>


----
Dan DeSloover
dand at zifferent.net



From radkins at impelind.com  Thu May 28 16:12:34 2009
From: radkins at impelind.com (Robert Adkins)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:12:34 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
Message-ID: <20090528204244.76C04C0C6@impelind.com>


> 
> Not only that every laptop I've worked on has an easy access 
> panel (4-6
> screws) to the hard drive bay and maybe another three screws 
> to remove the hard drive.
> 

	Then you have been mighty darn lucky.

	Some laptops can be a bear to remove/replace the HD. Some require
taking off a half dozen screws to remove a few pieces of plastic off the
"face" of the laptop to then remove a few screws to get the keyboard off and
THEN you can look at the HD location.

	No two laptops are always going to be the same.

	-Rob



From driveray at ameritech.net  Thu May 28 16:22:49 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:22:49 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>	<4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>
	<6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
Message-ID: <4A1EF299.8060308@ameritech.net>

Dan DeSloover wrote:
> Not only that every laptop I've worked on has an easy access panel (4-6
> screws) to the hard drive bay and maybe another three screws to remove the
> hard drive.

Some access panels take as few as 2 screws. The additional screws often
secure the drive to a loading tray, and/or interface connector.

> Garry Stahl wrote:
>> Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>> She currently has a 55 GB, I'm sure I wouldn't need more than that as
>>> she has not used up most of that already. If you ask my wife she'll
>>> tell you she needs much larger, I'm sure. I tried to talk her out of
>>> the 500 GB external, and she went ahead and got it 2 years ago,
>>> currently with less than 10 gigs of stuf on it. (Not the least of
>>> which is me backing mup my /home directory each time I upgrade,
>>> without her knowledge of course).

If you get a new drive its hard to find anything under 80 Gig. Lots of
room for two operating system if you want to dual boot. Or, if your
going with strictly linux you still have lots of room for a second
"emergency" install on a "hidden" (not mounted) partition that you can
boot into to fix the first one.

>> I have nothing in that range.  You also have to know SATA or EIDE.  They
>> are not interchangeable.  Getting the hard drive out it will be
>> obvious.  SATA has the narrow little plug, IDE is a wide one.
>>
>> Find out what you need.  Get same, replace.

At 55 Gig it's almost certainly IDE, but do get the manual and check.

>> --
>> Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.
>>
>> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
>> Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
>> The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
>> Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> mdlug mailing list
>> mdlug at mdlug.org
>> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>>
> 
> 
> ----
> Dan DeSloover
> dand at zifferent.net
> 
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
> 



From dcl400m at yahoo.com  Thu May 28 16:39:16 2009
From: dcl400m at yahoo.com (David Lane)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 13:39:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Intel's new DG45ID HDMI High Def. Video mother board And
	LINUX
Message-ID: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I just saw an Intel mother board that has both HD Audio and Video I just got a Blu-Ray/DVD drive and I'm hoping that I can load Linux to run audio/video.

Any thoughts 


David C. Lane 



      


From jcbender at bendorius.com  Thu May 28 16:44:00 2009
From: jcbender at bendorius.com (Joseph C. Bender)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:44:00 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <4A1EF299.8060308@ameritech.net>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>	<4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>	<6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
	<4A1EF299.8060308@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <4A1EF790.6000002@bendorius.com>

Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> Dan DeSloover wrote:
>> Not only that every laptop I've worked on has an easy access panel (4-6
>> screws) to the hard drive bay and maybe another three screws to remove the
>> hard drive.
> 
> Some access panels take as few as 2 screws. The additional screws often
> secure the drive to a loading tray, and/or interface connector.
> 
	This is why buying non-crappy laptops is always a good idea.

	One of the reasons I only buy Thinkpads is that the drives are 
replaceable quite easily.  It's one screw to remove the drive/bracket 
and 4 screws to remove the disk from the bracket.

	Your average cheap laptop puts the disk in stupid or hard to get to 
locations to save on materials costs.

-JCB


From micorral at comcast.net  Thu May 28 16:41:13 2009
From: micorral at comcast.net (Michael Corral)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 16:41:13 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>

2009-05-28, Monsieur Robert Jim Fulner a ecrit:
> Mike:
> 
> What do you mean:
> 
> 2009-05-21, Monsieur Robert Jim Fulner a ?crit:
> <snip>
> > Jim Fulner
> > Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
> > PO Box 252762
> > West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
> > 715-419-0445 (cell)
> >
> > http://www.lpocmi.org
> > Join our Group on Facebook:
> > http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts
> >
> > "Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""
> 
> WTF??
> 
> 
> 
> WTF: This is my name, title, mailing address, slogan, etc, typical signature
> information. Is there something in here that doesn't make sense? Do you
> simply strongly disagree with libertarianism and as such was[sic] surprised to
> see it? (I remember once reading on Linuxquestions.org, or maybe it was
> lewrockwell.com, that ever[sic] member of the Linux community is eitehr[sic] a
> libertarian or a socialist). The Open Source movement, and the Libertarian
> Party are both based on a simple thing FREEDOM, as such wouldn't you expect
> Libertarians to be in the Linux users group?

Bobby Jim,

Your signature amounted to one big political ad. We try (not always
successfully) to keep politics off the MDLUG list. No one here cares
about your political views (or those of anyone else).

Michael


From tesral at wowway.com  Thu May 28 17:02:58 2009
From: tesral at wowway.com (Garry Stahl)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 17:02:58 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
Message-ID: <4A1EFC02.4010102@wowway.com>

Michael Corral wrote
> Bobby Jim,
>
> Your signature amounted to one big political ad. We try (not always
> successfully) to keep politics off the MDLUG list. No one here cares
> about your political views (or those of anyone else).
>   

<Ex Cathedra>  Then don't read his signature.  The Moderator is not
prepared to censor anyone's sig file, yours, or his.  Unless such a
matter is totally out of line (which this is not) I am, not going to
ding anyone on what they want to say under their name.

Be not offensive, and be not be easily offended.  I point out the second
phrase.  </Ex Cathedra>

-- 
Garry  Stahl  MDLUG List Moderator.

Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org



From tesral at wowway.com  Thu May 28 17:13:29 2009
From: tesral at wowway.com (Garry Stahl)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 17:13:29 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <4A1EF790.6000002@bendorius.com>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>	<4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>	<6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>	<4A1EF299.8060308@ameritech.net>
	<4A1EF790.6000002@bendorius.com>
Message-ID: <4A1EFE79.8040507@wowway.com>

Joseph C. Bender wrote:
>
> 	One of the reasons I only buy Thinkpads is that the drives are 
> replaceable quite easily.  It's one screw to remove the drive/bracket 
> and 4 screws to remove the disk from the bracket.
>   
I like that about them as well, but he has what he has.  You want to
deal with the issue you have, not wish to deal with the issue you want.


-- 
Garry  AKA  --Phoenix--  Rising above the Flames.

Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
Star Trek mort. Viva la Star Trek admiraetur
The Olde Phoenix Inn http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com
Metro Detroit Linux Users Group http://www.mdlug.org



From audiotech50 at gmail.com  Thu May 28 17:32:51 2009
From: audiotech50 at gmail.com (Michael Rudas)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 17:32:51 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Intel's new DG45ID HDMI High Def. Video mother board
	And LINUX
In-Reply-To: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <b67fb0380905281432h4e86ad0eu2a36a907abc6d4f2@mail.gmail.com>

-- David Lane wrote:
> I just saw an Intel mother board that has both HD Audio and Video I just
> got a Blu-Ray/DVD drive and I'm hoping that I can load Linux to run
> audio/video. Any thoughts?

I'm thinking that it would be easier if you had posted the model number :-)

If all you're gonna do is audio/video, this will be fine--but the
Intel integrated graphics hardware is abysmal in general, slow and
lacking certain hardware features.  Adding a graphics card would help,
but that negates the value of the integrated A-V features on-board.

In this case, I would try to find an AMD-based motherboard with
similar features.  Even on-board graphics will be MUCH better--current
ATi and nVidia hardware, even integrated, runs RINGS around the
integrated Intel stuff.  A bonus--it's likely to be cheaper.

~~ Michael Rudas
    My home page: http://MRudas.2Ya.com
    My Protopage links: http://TinyURL.com/3wt54n


From micorral at comcast.net  Thu May 28 18:11:03 2009
From: micorral at comcast.net (Michael Corral)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 18:11:03 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <4A1EFC02.4010102@wowway.com>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<4A1EFC02.4010102@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281751210.6697@banana.sluggo.net>

2009-05-28, Monsieur Garry Stahl a ecrit:
>> Bobby Jim,
>>
>> Your signature amounted to one big political ad. We try (not always
>> successfully) to keep politics off the MDLUG list. No one here cares
>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).
>
> <Ex Cathedra>  Then don't read his signature.  The Moderator is not
> prepared to censor anyone's sig file, yours, or his.  Unless such a
> matter is totally out of line (which this is not) I am, not going to
> ding anyone on what they want to say under their name.
>
> Be not offensive, and be not be easily offended.  I point out the second
> phrase.  </Ex Cathedra>

Ok, Garry. I know you'll be impartial about this.

Michael

"[I]t's the philosophy of a snotty teen, someone who's read too much
Heinlein, absorbed the sordid notion that an intellectual elite should
rule the subhuman masses, and convinced himself that reading a few bad
novels qualifies him as a member of the elite."

  -- What's wrong with libertarianism, http://www.zompist.com/libertos.html


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Thu May 28 19:13:45 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 19:13:45 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281751210.6697@banana.sluggo.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<4A1EFC02.4010102@wowway.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281751210.6697@banana.sluggo.net>
Message-ID: <4A1F1AA9.2020009@gmail.com>

Michael Corral wrote:
> 2009-05-28, Monsieur Garry Stahl a ecrit:
>>> Bobby Jim,
>>>
>>> Your signature amounted to one big political ad. We try (not always
>>> successfully) to keep politics off the MDLUG list. No one here cares
>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).
>> <Ex Cathedra>  Then don't read his signature.  The Moderator is not
>> prepared to censor anyone's sig file, yours, or his.  Unless such a
>> matter is totally out of line (which this is not) I am, not going to
>> ding anyone on what they want to say under their name.
>>
>> Be not offensive, and be not be easily offended.  I point out the second
>> phrase.  </Ex Cathedra>
> 
> Ok, Garry. I know you'll be impartial about this.
> 
> Michael
> 
> "[I]t's the philosophy of a snotty teen, someone who's read too much
> Heinlein, absorbed the sordid notion that an intellectual elite should
> rule the subhuman masses, and convinced himself that reading a few bad
> novels qualifies him as a member of the elite."


> 
>   -- What's wrong with libertarianism, http://www.zompist.com/libertos.html


Libertarians don't believe in any "elite" to be a member of.
It's the socialists who believe in an elite vanguard.

 -- me on what's wrong with zompist's view on libertarianism.


From jhansonxi at gmail.com  Thu May 28 19:39:26 2009
From: jhansonxi at gmail.com (Jeff Hanson)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 19:39:26 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Intel's new DG45ID HDMI High Def. Video mother board
	And LINUX
In-Reply-To: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <b02c40e90905281639y2fadf1adg4f08876bd0fff0ed@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 4:39 PM, David Lane <dcl400m at yahoo.com> wrote:
> I just saw an Intel mother board that has both HD Audio and Video I just got a Blu-Ray/DVD drive and I'm hoping that I can load Linux to run audio/video.
>
> Any thoughts
>

The video drivers for Intel are a real mess currently due to the
changes in X.org they haven't kept up with:

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReinhardTartler/X/RevertingIntelDriverTo2.4

Intel is pushing for the changes, especially for integrated video, so
it's partly their fault.


From peter at petertheplumber.net  Thu May 28 20:29:57 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 20:29:57 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <14048061.1243530011040.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <14048061.1243530011040.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <1243556997.8625.282.camel@plumber-notebook.site>

On Thu, 2009-05-28 at 13:00 -0400, R. Kannan wrote:
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Michael Rudas <audiotech50 at gmail.com>
> >Sent: May 28, 2009 11:40 AM
> >To: Stan at mcomputersolutions.com, 

<snip>

> >Realize that no matter who your "provider" is, all provisioning
> >(hardware) is provided by AT & T.  They now have "naked" DSL for as
> >little as $20 a month.  I've been a customer for 7 years, starting at
> >768kbps.  I currently have 6Mbps service with them--I'm looking into
> >the new 18 Mbps service...
> 
> Just out of curiosity, how much do they charge for 6Mbps or 18 Mbps service ? Do you actually get the advertised speed?
> >
I have the DSL-Elite package which lists the speeds as Downstream Speed:
3 Mbps - Up to 6 Mbps Upstream Speed: Up to 512 Kbps. Cost is $35/month.
Speed was 608Mbps outbound, 5.08Mbps inbound, measured at
<http://speedtest.umflint.edu/> just now. 

Best Regards,

-- 
Peter Bart <peter at petertheplumber.net>
Peter The Plumber



From dcl400m at yahoo.com  Thu May 28 22:07:38 2009
From: dcl400m at yahoo.com (David Lane)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 19:07:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Intel's new DG45ID HDMI High Def. Video mother board
	And LINUX
In-Reply-To: <b67fb0380905281432h4e86ad0eu2a36a907abc6d4f2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <761249.49533.qm@web37903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<b67fb0380905281432h4e86ad0eu2a36a907abc6d4f2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <392641.74787.qm@web37906.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Here it is on new Egg for $99: it is the BOXDG45ID

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121355

David C. Lane 





________________________________
From: Michael Rudas <audiotech50 at gmail.com>
To: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Sent: Thursday, May 28, 2009 5:32:51 PM
Subject: Re: [mdlug] Intel's new DG45ID HDMI High Def. Video mother board And LINUX

-- David Lane wrote:
> I just saw an Intel mother board that has both HD Audio and Video I just
> got a Blu-Ray/DVD drive and I'm hoping that I can load Linux to run
> audio/video. Any thoughts?

I'm thinking that it would be easier if you had posted the model number :-)

If all you're gonna do is audio/video, this will be fine--but the
Intel integrated graphics hardware is abysmal in general, slow and
lacking certain hardware features.  Adding a graphics card would help,
but that negates the value of the integrated A-V features on-board.

In this case, I would try to find an AMD-based motherboard with
similar features.  Even on-board graphics will be MUCH better--current
ATi and nVidia hardware, even integrated, runs RINGS around the
integrated Intel stuff.  A bonus--it's likely to be cheaper.

~~ Michael Rudas
    My home page: http://MRudas.2Ya.com
    My Protopage links: http://TinyURL.com/3wt54n
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug



      


From jcbender at bendorius.com  Thu May 28 23:06:52 2009
From: jcbender at bendorius.com (Joseph C. Bender)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 23:06:52 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] laptop harddrive
In-Reply-To: <4A1EFE79.8040507@wowway.com>
References: <c768576f0905281159p13eb6d03w166e04a138cbeb1c@mail.gmail.com>	<4A1EE0DD.8010803@wowway.com>	<6620.12.107.188.5.1243541009.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>	<4A1EF299.8060308@ameritech.net>	<4A1EF790.6000002@bendorius.com>
	<4A1EFE79.8040507@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <4A1F514C.2040405@bendorius.com>

Garry Stahl wrote:

> I like that about them as well, but he has what he has.  You want to
> deal with the issue you have, not wish to deal with the issue you want.
> 
> 
	Gee, you think?  I didn't tell him he sucks because of the laptop he's 
got, just why I prefer what I do.  Don't read too much into what I'm 
saying, you might hurt yourself.

	Go spend your time lecturing to someone else, I don't want to hear it.

-JCB


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Thu May 28 23:11:27 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 23:11:27 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905281122t2df47b61v386ce53e5e19512a@mail.gmail.com>
	(message from Robert Jim Fulner on Thu, 28 May 2009 14:22:50 -0400)
References: <c768576f0905281122t2df47b61v386ce53e5e19512a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090529031127.1A05620AAEC@starfox.local>

Jon, Ron, Joseph, Jim,

> There's a newer plugin for Evolution that uses OpenChange
> (http://www.openchange.org/) that uses the native MAPI protocol ...

Installed and so far, working well.

Thank you,
-- 
Bob

  "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."
     -- Albert Einstein



From fulner at gmail.com  Thu May 28 23:58:39 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 23:58:39 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
Message-ID: <c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>

I appologize and I assure you that I meant no disrespect to anyone. The
simple comment "WTF" certainly threw me off guard. A better response would
have been to politely note that my signature was considerd political and as
such it would be preferred to not be included in an MDLUG post as per
policy.

In the future I assure you that I will attempt to remember to delete my
siganture from posts to MDLUG. (Almost forgot to do so just in this one).

BTW: . "No one here cares
about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
opinion of each and every one of you.

Yours truly,
Jim Fulner
DetroitLIbertyPenguin

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 4:41 PM, Michael Corral <micorral at comcast.net>wrote:

> 2009-05-28, Monsieur Robert Jim Fulner a ecrit:
>
>> Mike:
>>
>> What do you mean:
>>
>> 2009-05-21, Monsieur Robert Jim Fulner a ?crit:
>> <snip>
>> > Jim Fulner
>> > Chair Libertarian Party of Oakland County
>> > PO Box 252762
>> > West Bloomfield, Michigan 48325
>> > 715-419-0445 (cell)
>> >
>> > http://www.lpocmi.org
>> > Join our Group on Facebook:
>> > http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/group.php?gid=65842726699&ref=ts
>> >
>> > "Restore the constitution, join the Libertarian Revolution""
>>
>> WTF??
>>
>>
>>
>> WTF: This is my name, title, mailing address, slogan, etc, typical
>> signature
>> information. Is there something in here that doesn't make sense? Do you
>> simply strongly disagree with libertarianism and as such was[sic]
>> surprised to
>> see it? (I remember once reading on Linuxquestions.org, or maybe it was
>> lewrockwell.com, that ever[sic] member of the Linux community is
>> eitehr[sic] a
>> libertarian or a socialist). The Open Source movement, and the Libertarian
>> Party are both based on a simple thing FREEDOM, as such wouldn't you
>> expect
>> Libertarians to be in the Linux users group?
>>
>
> Bobby Jim,
>
> Your signature amounted to one big political ad. We try (not always
> successfully) to keep politics off the MDLUG list. No one here cares
> about your political views (or those of anyone else).
>
> Michael
>


From fulner at gmail.com  Fri May 29 02:30:13 2009
From: fulner at gmail.com (Robert Jim Fulner)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 02:30:13 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
Message-ID: <c768576f0905282330i132e2761mfda81ab78c3edf80@mail.gmail.com>

Bob et. al:
I'm still not sure what i'm doing wrong. I've spent the last couple hours
working on this again. Installed evolution-mapi via apt-get
Didn't notice any differnt options according to
http://ww.go-evolution.org/MAPI_FAQ I should have a MAPI plugin available to
enable under EDIT -> plugins to activate
Granted I spent quite a bit of time trying to indentify my exchange server
per those instructions as well as an idap browser is a new idea in and of
itself to me...
>> There's a newer plugin for Evolution that uses OpenChange
>> (http://www.openchange.org/) that uses the native MAPI protocol ...
>
>Installed and so far, working well.
>
>Thank you,
--
Bob

 "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."
  -- Albert Einstein


-- 
Jim Fulner


From gib at juno.com  Fri May 29 08:06:16 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 12:06:16 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  OT: Good DSL Provider? AT&T good DSL, poor service
Message-ID: <20090529.080616.5014.0@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>

 
I've been happy with AT&T. I just upgraded to the Uvers 10Mpbs.  The install techs seemed knowledgeable but a second install tech corrected a problem from the first.  I'm left with a really odd set-up. My experience was that a poor scheduling back office procedure inconvenienced me twice (two days in a row I was given a time that differed from what the tech was told). 
The next day after the install the battery on the battery back up failed. (Why would you make a battery back up not allow the device to work when you have power?) A call to the help desk was extremely poor quality support.  The help desk person tried to go through a procedure without any understanding of the issue.  She tried to connect up to the 2-Wire device when I told her that it had no power.  

---------- Original Message ----------
From: Peter Bart <peter at petertheplumber.net>
To: mdlug at mdlug.org
Cc: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Subject: Re: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 09:22:18 +0000

On Wed, 27 May 2009 21:22:05 -0400 (EDT)
"R. Kannan" <rkannan at peoplepc.com> wrote:

> I have AT&T (1.5 - 3Mbps)and have not had any problems for past three
> years. I had one outage for 6 hrs during that time. But if you are
> looking for good knowlegeable support, forget it. The tech support
> does not know anything other than 'reboot the windows'

I second that about ATT, except that tech support is getting
more Linux friendly. The last problem I had over a year
ago;with getting mail; was solved after I refused to reboot.

Best Regards,
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm

Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug

____________________________________________________________
Inventors: Does your idea have potential for millions? Click for info.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsFRu588wvZpx2xkivKVhTWT2k1l6fVit3OZDMdXIkYQ9djZxZxNyI/


From Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com  Fri May 29 10:42:24 2009
From: Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com (Ingles, Raymond)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 10:42:24 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
References: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3D7@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>

> From: Robert Jim Fulner

> In the future I assure you that I will attempt to remember to delete
my
> siganture from posts to MDLUG. (Almost forgot to do so just in this
one).

 No need. I've never worried about it and I've got some fairly pointed
ones.

 Sincerely,

 Ray Ingles                                   (313) 227-2317

  "No federal income tax was assessed before 1913, because
  government didn't require the kind of dough it needs now
         that it's running a concierge business."
 - Bill Maher, "When You Ride Alone You Ride With bin Laden"
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it.


From danno at umich.edu  Fri May 29 13:01:44 2009
From: danno at umich.edu (Dan Pritts)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 13:01:44 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> BTW: . "No one here cares
> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
> opinion of each and every one of you.

It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.

If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
care what you have in your signature file.  

> Yours truly,
> Jim Fulner
> DetroitLIbertyPenguin

regards

danno

dan pritts
annarborguntotinliberalapplefanboy
NRA Member (amendment 2)
ACLU Member (the other 9)


From billings at negate.org  Fri May 29 14:02:19 2009
From: billings at negate.org (Jonathan Billings)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 14:02:19 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090529180219.GA18059@rhea.lsait.lsa.umich.edu>

On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
> In the future I assure you that I will attempt to remember to delete my
> siganture from posts to MDLUG. (Almost forgot to do so just in this one).

It'd probably be enough (for me) to just have a '--' alone on a line
before your sig, so my mailer knew it was a signature and can color it
differently than the body of your text.

I used to have a script that ran in procmail to replace certain
people's email signature because of how obnoxious they'd be.  For
example, my wife's company's email system added on a 2 page legal
disclaimer automatically, which I'd chop off before it landed in my
mailbox.  (I sometimes wonder what their legal department would think
of that...)

-- 
Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>


From micorral at comcast.net  Fri May 29 16:09:09 2009
From: micorral at comcast.net (Michael Corral)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 16:09:09 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>

2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>
> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>
> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
> care what you have in your signature file.

Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.

For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).

Michael


From cvweiss at gmail.com  Fri May 29 16:17:08 2009
From: cvweiss at gmail.com (Clinton Weiss)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 16:17:08 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
Message-ID: <4A2042C4.7090406@gmail.com>

So... with this annoying thread going on, I decided to try and revisit 
an old pet peeve of mine, Thunderbird's inability to ignore/watch a 
thread.  Seems someone once created an add on for this purpose, but it's 
no longer supported.  Does anyone have or know of an extension that will 
do this?  Or can you recommend an open source client that integrates 
well with IMAP that will do this as well?

<rant>
Once upon a time, we'll call it the 90's, I used an email/newsgroup 
client called Forte Agent, and it's ability to ignore threads on the 
newsgroups was just awesome sauce all the way.  It was as simple as 
typing "I" for any message on the thread, and from then on every message 
in the thread would be automatically marked read and skipped.  Why many 
good (aka Thunderbird) modern clients don't have this feature is beyond me.
</rant>

Clinton

--
signature removed, as it might advertise my identity :)


From driveray at ameritech.net  Fri May 29 18:37:12 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 18:37:12 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>
	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>
Message-ID: <4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>

Michael Corral wrote:
> 2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
>> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>>
>> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
>> care what you have in your signature file.
> 
> Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
> for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
> Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
> should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
> a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.
> 
> For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
> on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
> but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
> his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).
> 
> Michael

I disagree with you here Michael. I regard signatures like  bumper
stickers. I wouldn't expect anyone to take a sticker off their car to
come to a meeting, and I don't expect anyone to change their sigfile
just to  post to our list. If you disagree with one that you see write
your own in reply. Or just ignore it. Personally I find the commercial
advertisements that some mail services affix more objectionable than
anyone's considered opinion. But it's really not worth taking issue with.

Too much issue has been take as it is.

Raymond McLaughlin





From peter at petertheplumber.net  Fri May 29 11:30:11 2009
From: peter at petertheplumber.net (Peter Bart)
Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 15:30:11 +0000
Subject: [mdlug] OFFTOPIC  Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via
In-Reply-To: <319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3D7@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
References: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>
	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>
	<319C03F7A120754B9128CF308BF5E0370120B3D7@nasa-dtw-ex004.nasa.cpwr.corp>
Message-ID: <20090529153011.345c647b@Nokia-N810-43-7>

On Fri, 29 May 2009 10:42:24 -0400
"Ingles, Raymond" <Raymond.Ingles at compuware.com> wrote:

> > From: Robert Jim Fulner
> 
> > In the future I assure you that I will attempt to remember to delete
> my
> > siganture from posts to MDLUG. (Almost forgot to do so just in this
> one).
> 
>  No need. I've never worried about it and I've got some fairly pointed
> ones.
>

	But allways entertaining! In fact I forward them from time to
	time, like this one.
 
>  Sincerely,
> 
>  Ray Ingles                                   (313) 227-2317
> 
>   "No federal income tax was assessed before 1913, because
>   government didn't require the kind of dough it needs now
>          that it's running a concierge business."
>  - Bill Maher, "When You Ride Alone You Ride With bin Laden"
Best Regards,
-- 
Peter The Plumber sm
Sent from a mobile Internet Tablet


From mdbader at flash.net  Sat May 30 09:01:17 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 09:01:17 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>
	<4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <4A212E1D.2020007@flash.net>

In mine, I allow one or two text lines, no graphics, no links, no 
politics or religion.

Mike Bader

On 5/29/2009 6:37 PM, Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> Michael Corral wrote:
>    
>> 2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
>>      
>>> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>>        
>>>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>>>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>>>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>>>>          
>>> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>>>
>>> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
>>> care what you have in your signature file.
>>>        
>> Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
>> for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
>> Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
>> should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
>> a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.
>>
>> For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
>> on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
>> but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
>> his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).
>>
>> Michael
>>      
>
> I disagree with you here Michael. I regard signatures like  bumper
> stickers. I wouldn't expect anyone to take a sticker off their car to
> come to a meeting, and I don't expect anyone to change their sigfile
> just to  post to our list. If you disagree with one that you see write
> your own in reply. Or just ignore it. Personally I find the commercial
> advertisements that some mail services affix more objectionable than
> anyone's considered opinion. But it's really not worth taking issue with.
>
> Too much issue has been take as it is.
>
> Raymond McLaughlin
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>    


From gib at juno.com  Sat May 30 19:53:11 2009
From: gib at juno.com (gib at juno.com)
Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 23:53:11 GMT
Subject: [mdlug]  BACK ON TOPIC OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
Message-ID: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>


How about if we put this back into a technical discussion.  

1. Are there mail clients that will allow you to send signature files that are customized to the recipients rules?

2. Is there mail services that will enforce signature rules?

3. Are there generally accepted rules that can be considered?

---------- Original Message ----------
From: mike bader <mdbader at flash.net>
To: MDLUG's Main discussion list <mdlug at mdlug.org>
Subject: Re: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 09:01:17 -0400

In mine, I allow one or two text lines, no graphics, no links, no 
politics or religion.

Mike Bader

On 5/29/2009 6:37 PM, Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> Michael Corral wrote:
>    
>> 2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
>>      
>>> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>>        
>>>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>>>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>>>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>>>>          
>>> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>>>
>>> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
>>> care what you have in your signature file.
>>>        
>> Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
>> for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
>> Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
>> should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
>> a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.
>>
>> For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
>> on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
>> but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
>> his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).
>>
>> Michael
>>      
>
> I disagree with you here Michael. I regard signatures like  bumper
> stickers. I wouldn't expect anyone to take a sticker off their car to
> come to a meeting, and I don't expect anyone to change their sigfile
> just to  post to our list. If you disagree with one that you see write
> your own in reply. Or just ignore it. Personally I find the commercial
> advertisements that some mail services affix more objectionable than
> anyone's considered opinion. But it's really not worth taking issue with.
>
> Too much issue has been take as it is.
>
> Raymond McLaughlin
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>    
_______________________________________________
mdlug mailing list
mdlug at mdlug.org
http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug


____________________________________________________________
Compete with the big boys.  Click here to find products to benefit your business.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsHcQaIaKNQw7sS5k6vSpNY8rQugNnGGxTEnKXbQF0BFr5ZPZg2vT6/


From mdbader at flash.net  Sat May 30 22:17:37 2009
From: mdbader at flash.net (mike bader)
Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 22:17:37 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] BACK ON TOPIC OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>
References: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>
Message-ID: <4A21E8C1.4040307@flash.net>

There are thunderbird add-ons to select different signatures,

mike bader

On 5/30/2009 7:53 PM, gib at juno.com wrote:
> How about if we put this back into a technical discussion.
>
> 1. Are there mail clients that will allow you to send signature files that are customized to the recipients rules?
>
> 2. Is there mail services that will enforce signature rules?
>
> 3. Are there generally accepted rules that can be considered?
>
> ---------- Original Message ----------
> From: mike bader<mdbader at flash.net>
> To: MDLUG's Main discussion list<mdlug at mdlug.org>
> Subject: Re: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
> Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 09:01:17 -0400
>
> In mine, I allow one or two text lines, no graphics, no links, no
> politics or religion.
>
> Mike Bader
>
> On 5/29/2009 6:37 PM, Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
>    
>> Michael Corral wrote:
>>
>>      
>>> 2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
>>>
>>>        
>>>> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>>>
>>>>          
>>>>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>>>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>>>>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>>>>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>>>>>
>>>>>            
>>>> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>>>>
>>>> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
>>>> care what you have in your signature file.
>>>>
>>>>          
>>> Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
>>> for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
>>> Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
>>> should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
>>> a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.
>>>
>>> For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
>>> on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
>>> but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
>>> his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).
>>>
>>> Michael
>>>
>>>        
>> I disagree with you here Michael. I regard signatures like  bumper
>> stickers. I wouldn't expect anyone to take a sticker off their car to
>> come to a meeting, and I don't expect anyone to change their sigfile
>> just to  post to our list. If you disagree with one that you see write
>> your own in reply. Or just ignore it. Personally I find the commercial
>> advertisements that some mail services affix more objectionable than
>> anyone's considered opinion. But it's really not worth taking issue with.
>>
>> Too much issue has been take as it is.
>>
>> Raymond McLaughlin
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> mdlug mailing list
>> mdlug at mdlug.org
>> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>>
>>
>>      
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Compete with the big boys.  Click here to find products to benefit your business.
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsHcQaIaKNQw7sS5k6vSpNY8rQugNnGGxTEnKXbQF0BFr5ZPZg2vT6/
> _______________________________________________
> mdlug mailing list
> mdlug at mdlug.org
> http://mdlug.org/mailman/listinfo/mdlug
>
>    


From billings at negate.org  Sat May 30 22:28:36 2009
From: billings at negate.org (Jonathan Billings)
Date: Sat, 30 May 2009 22:28:36 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] BACK ON TOPIC OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>
References: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>
Message-ID: <20090531022836.GC1024@netra.local>

On Sat, May 30, 2009 at 11:53:11PM +0000, gib at juno.com wrote:
> 1. Are there mail clients that will allow you to send signature
> files that are customized to the recipients rules? 

I can answer this question with one example:  Mutt.  You can set a
send-hook to be defined to use a different signature based on a
pattern.  Just set that pattern to include whatever recipient you want
to have sent a custom signature.

-- 
Jonathan Billings <billings at negate.org>


From akulkis00 at gmail.com  Sun May 31 05:30:20 2009
From: akulkis00 at gmail.com (Aaron Kulkis)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 05:30:20 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>
	<4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>
Message-ID: <4A224E2C.9020002@gmail.com>

Raymond McLaughlin wrote:
> Michael Corral wrote:
>> 2009-05-29, Monsieur Dan Pritts a ecrit:
>>> On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 11:58:39PM -0400, Robert Jim Fulner wrote:
>>>> BTW: . "No one here cares
>>>> about your political views (or those of anyone else).", is not actually an
>>>> accurate treatment as that would exclude me. I care about the political
>>>> opinion of each and every one of you.
>>> It's also an untrue statement on the face of it.
>>>
>>> If the writer didn't care about your political views, they wouldn't
>>> care what you have in your signature file.
>> Not true at all. I'd say the same thing whether a signature was an ad
>> for the Democratic Party, Republican Party, Libertarian Party, Loony
>> Party, etc. Explicit calls to join a political party (of any stripe)
>> should be left off this list, in my opinion, whether they are part of
>> a signature or the main body of an email. It's just in bad taste.
>>
>> For example, MDLUG list moderator Garry Stahl has a pro-Libertarian bit
>> on his website (<http://phoenixinn.iwarp.com/Politicks/whatis.html>),
>> but I've never seen an explicit call to join the Libertarian Party in
>> his posts to the list (please don't start now, Garry! :).
>>
>> Michael
> 
> I disagree with you here Michael. I regard signatures like  bumper
> stickers. I wouldn't expect anyone to take a sticker off their car to
> come to a meeting, and I don't expect anyone to change their sigfile
> just to  post to our list. If you disagree with one that you see write
> your own in reply. Or just ignore it. Personally I find the commercial
> advertisements that some mail services affix more objectionable than
> anyone's considered opinion. But it's really not worth taking issue with.
> 

However, the other Ray seems to take GREAT offense when someone
comments on his "bumper sticker" .sig files.

To me, if you don't want a reaction, then don't provoke one.

I prefer that MDLUG be non-political, yet when we get saturated
at times with political messages at the end of postings, then
to let that go constantly unanswered, if one disagrees, is to
make the appearance that all agree with it -- which is how
political correctness and silencing of minority opinions
start...with "groupthink"




> Too much issue has been take as it is.
> 
> Raymond McLaughlin


From driveray at ameritech.net  Sun May 31 05:48:33 2009
From: driveray at ameritech.net (Raymond McLaughlin)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 05:48:33 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <4A224E2C.9020002@gmail.com>
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>	<4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net>
	<4A224E2C.9020002@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A225271.6000102@ameritech.net>

Aaron Kulkis wrote:

> However, the other Ray seems to take GREAT offense when someone
> comments on his "bumper sticker" .sig files. 
> To me, if you don't want a reaction, then don't provoke one.
> I prefer that MDLUG be non-political, yet when we get saturated
> at times with political messages at the end of postings, then
> to let that go constantly unanswered,

As I indicated, the best was to answer a bumper sticker is with another
bumper sticker. The best way to answer a sigfile is with another sigfile.

These topics do not belong in the main body of discussion. Except, of
course on the discuss list.

Raymond McLaughlin


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Sun May 31 09:24:55 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 09:24:55 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com> (gib@juno.com)
References: <20090530.195311.28277.1@webmail19.vgs.untd.com>
Message-ID: <20090531132455.41CA120AADA@starfox.local>

Gib,

> How about if we put this back into a technical discussion.

Thank you.

> 1. Are there mail clients that will allow you to send signature files
> that are customized to the recipients rules?

I doubt such exists, as such a mail client would need to parse
each signature and query each recipient.

Most clients support a means of setting a default signature and
selecting a signature when composing.

evolution and kmail:
  choose identity (from field:) and corresponding settings
    including default signature.
  choose signature from a configurable list

emacs:
  "mail-signature's value is ...
   Documentation:
   *Text inserted at end of mail buffer when a message is initialized.
   If t, it means to insert the contents of the file `mail-signature-file'.
   If a string, that string is inserted. ...
   Otherwise, it should be an expression; ..."

> 2. Is there mail services that will enforce signature rules?

Many mail services append signatures as a means of gaining advertising
revenue.  Many years ago, most mail services tried to enforce signature
rules (usually limiting length), but this only pushed spammers to
pollute content.  The resulting arms race was a
battle lost early in the history of spam.  Today, spam filters evolved
to allow more leeway after a signature marker ("e.g. --") thus
encouraging spammers not stopped to at least favor the signature.

See Emily PostNews (http://www.faqs.org/faqs/usenet/emily-postnews/part1/)
for further netiquette.



Most mail clients allow you to filter mail (e.g. direct it to a
junk/spam/trash directory) based on configurable rules.

procmailrc(5):
  ...
  :0:
  * ^from:.*spammer\@spam.com.*
  spam.raw
  ...

kmail:
  [Message/Create filter] ...



Some mail services only handle encrypted mail, which forces a minimum
effort for each message-recipient pairing, and so favors legitimate
mail (usually sent to fewer recipients) over spam (usually seeking
minimal cost per recipient).  IMHO, the objections to encrypted mail
and attack of supporting systems, has usually been by spammers.

Hopefully helpful,
-- 
Bob


  "If you can buy chicken nuggets in packs of 6, 9, or 20,
   what is the largest number you cannot buy?
   (rot13) sbegl-guerr"
      -- unknown



From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Sun May 31 10:09:25 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 10:09:25 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] Accessing the Microsoft Exchange Server via Evolution
In-Reply-To: <c768576f0905282330i132e2761mfda81ab78c3edf80@mail.gmail.com>
	(message from Robert Jim Fulner on Fri, 29 May 2009 02:30:13 -0400)
References: <c768576f0905282330i132e2761mfda81ab78c3edf80@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090531140925.1645220AAED@starfox.local>

Jim,

> I'm still not sure what [I'm] doing wrong. I've spent the last couple hours
> working on this again. Installed evolution-mapi via apt-get
> Didn't notice any [different] options[.]  [According] to
> http://ww.go-evolution.org/MAPI_FAQ I should have a MAPI plugin available to
> enable under EDIT -> plugins to activate[.]
> Granted I spent quite a bit of time trying to [identify] my exchange server
> per those instructions as well as an idap browser is a new idea in and of
> itself to me...

Under CentOS-5 evolution, the plugin does not appear under new plugins,
from which I infer that it has no required configurable options.

(N.B. I don't have evolution handy, so the following menu locations are
untested.)
A new menu choice, MAPI, appeared under [Edit/Settings/Accounts/Add...]
for Server Type: .  I was able to select MAPI instead of Exchange
and upon doing so, dialog labels changed.  In particular, [Authenticate]
made debugging the identification of MAPI server much easier.

Hopefully helpful,
-- 
Bob

  "The gulls who scorn perfection for the sake of travel,
      go nowehere slowly.
   The gulls who scorn travel for the sake of perfection,
      go anywhere instantly."
	-- Chang, Jonathan Livingston Seagull by Richard Bach


From list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net  Sun May 31 12:12:17 2009
From: list1c30fe42 at bellsouth.net (Robert Meier)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 12:12:17 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [mdlug] OFF OFFTOPIC  Sigfiles
In-Reply-To: <20090531155000.89EE620AADA@starfox.local> (message from Robert
	Meier on Sun, 31 May 2009 11:50:00 -0400 (EDT))
References: <c768576f0905281130x2c9cf19bxd97ca4bc43e26a23@mail.gmail.com>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905281632080.5552@banana.sluggo.net>	<c768576f0905282058j2107c3f6xfedb4801f9933e50@mail.gmail.com>	<20090529170144.GA19218@maniac.deathstar.org>	<alpine.LFD.2.00.0905291548480.2382@banana.sluggo.net>
	<4A206398.8000208@ameritech.net> <4A224E2C.9020002@gmail.com>
	<20090531155000.89EE620AADA@starfox.local>
Message-ID: <20090531161217.E0BF020AAEC@starfox.local>

Aaron et al,

[Reply-to set to mdlug-discuss at mdlug.org]

Please move this non-linux discussion to mdlug-discuss

TIA,
-- 
Bob

    "An armed society is a polite society.
     Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."
       -- Robert Heinlein

  "Science is the great antidote to the poison of enthusiasm and superstition."
     -- Adam Smith

  "Nothing has such power to broaden the mind,
   as the ability to investigate systematically and truly,
   all that comes under thy observation in life."
     -- Marcus Aurelius

  "Never trust a computer you can't throw out a window."
     -- Steve Wozniak

  "Computer science is no more about computers,
   than astronomy is about telescopes."
     -- Edsger Dijkstra



From rjclay at gmail.com  Sun May 31 22:04:27 2009
From: rjclay at gmail.com (Robert J. Clay)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 22:04:27 -0400
Subject: [mdlug] OT: Good DSL Provider?
In-Reply-To: <59050.10.1.1.111.1243476389.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
References: <13550090.1243473725611.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<59050.10.1.1.111.1243476389.squirrel@www.zifferent.net>
Message-ID: <a379574a0905311904s61ec7d2ai5e46f9fa6a6ed33a@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 10:06 PM, Dan DeSloover <dand at zifferent.net> wrote:
> I won't go cable because they are such enormous douchebags about blocking
> ports, running home servers and using routers and switches behind their
> equipment.

    Rather depends on which cable service you have available;  I
haven't been seeing those kind of issues...   (Road Runner via Bright
House networks...)



-- 
Robert J. Clay
rjclay at gmail.com


